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Food Words

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Bill Spohn

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Food Words

by Bill Spohn » Sun Aug 20, 2023 3:36 pm

Those who stray into the other sections of the board may know that I am fascinated with how vocabulary is developed. I thought that I would post some words related to food here.

Offal - what is left after an animal is butchered - consists of a lot of material that has no or little culinary use, but also organ meats like heart, kidneys , liver and such. It is an old word, used since the 13th C in the sense of byproducts of something (in this case animal butchering) and later came to mean anything discarded, animal or not.

Haggis - an easy segue from offal to haggis, which is heart, liver, and lungs of a sheep or a calf minced with suet, onions, oatmeal, and seasonings and boiled in the stomach of the animal (traditionally, at least). I used to partake on Burns Night suppers but otherwise rarely and then only eating Bowdlerized versions without the really strong organ meat flavours that make it unpopular with some.

Spotted Dick - one for Peter - a pudding made with suet and currants or raisins, usually served with a whitish custard sauce poured over it. Not my cup of tea.

Mountain oysters - if your gorge was rising after the previous one, this dish of Rocky Mountain oysters—also known as prairie oysters, cowboy caviar, and Montana tendergroin consists of the testes of male animals, removed to tame them (it would have the opposite effect, I should think) and rather than being wasted, are breaded, fried and served with some sort of dipping sauce. Has anyone sampled these? I haven't but am curious.
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Re: Food Words

by Paul Winalski » Sun Aug 20, 2023 6:09 pm

Bill Spohn wrote:testes of male animals, removed to tame them (it would have the opposite effect, I should think)


Uncastrated male herd animals (stallions, bulls, rams) are very aggressive, stubborn, and tend to establish a hierarchy within their herd. A co-worker of mine had a flock of sheep, and when he had to deal with the rams he always took a ball-peen hammer with him. If the ram got stroppy, he would whack it with the hammer on the skull bone between the horns with all of his might. The ram thinks it's just been butted by a superior ram in the hierarchy and calms down. Bulls are notoriously ill-tempered and strong-willed and sometimes the only way to tether them is via a rope through a ring in the bull's nose.

All of these behaviors are tied to testosterone levels. Castrating the animal removes the urge for dominance and makes it far more docile. Oxen used as beasts of burden or labor are nearly always castrated males (called steeers if they are destined for the dinner table).

Some more types of offal:

Tripe is the stomach of an animal (or stomachs, in the case of ruminants).

Lights is the lungs in British English (and elsewhere in the Commonwealth?). The term is unknown in US English.

For example, this joke from a BBC radio comedy of the 1960s: The protagonists of the sketch have been swallowed by a whale. The narrator says, "farther and farther they traveled down the whale's gullet, until they reached the stomach, where they had to stop." "Why??" "Because the lights were against them."

-Paul W.
Last edited by Paul Winalski on Mon Aug 21, 2023 1:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Food Words

by DanS » Mon Aug 21, 2023 7:42 am

Bill Spohn wrote:Mountain oysters - if your gorge was rising after the previous one, this dish of Rocky Mountain oysters—also known as prairie oysters, cowboy caviar, and Montana tendergroin consists of the testes of male animals, removed to tame them (it would have the opposite effect, I should think) and rather than being wasted, are breaded, fried and served with some sort of dipping sauce. Has anyone sampled these? I haven't but am curious.


I've never heard of RMO called cowboy caviar. I always thought (and a quick DuckDuckGo search) says it is black-eyed peas, black beans, corn, tomatoes, etc.

https://www.wellandgood.com/what-is-cowboy-caviar/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_caviar
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Re: Food Words

by Bill Spohn » Tue Aug 22, 2023 12:27 pm

Thanks for that recipe, Dan! I put it aside tro try - sounds good.

On the terminology:

Rocky Mountain oysters, which also go by other names like prairie oysters, mountain tenders, calf fries and cowboy caviar, date back to the rancher explosion resulting from expansion into the American and Canadian West.


https://www.10best.com/interests/food-c ... ian%20West. and

https://foodspiceandallthingsnice.wordp ... -na-skara/ for instance, but I'd agree that it is a less common term.
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Re: Food Words

by Paul Winalski » Tue Aug 22, 2023 3:21 pm

A new one (at least to me): scape--a leafless stem bearing a plant's flower that grows directly from the roots. The stir-fried bacon with Sichuan bean sauces that I made last night calls for garlic scapes.

-Paul W.
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Re: Food Words

by Bill Spohn » Wed Aug 23, 2023 10:51 am

Yes, 'garlic scapes' was the only way I had heard of them too. (Once you eat them, are they exscapees....)
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Re: Food Words

by Peter May » Wed Aug 23, 2023 12:24 pm

Bill Spohn wrote:
Spotted Dick - one for Peter - a pudding made with suet and currants or raisins, usually served with a whitish custard sauce poured over it. Not my cup of tea.


Spotted Dick - lot of work for the cook and I've not had it since a youngster when my mum made it. It was steamed for ages in a muslin cloth, she made it tubular and cut slices off. I don't know what 'a whitish custard sauce' is, we either had custard or more delicious was spreading butter on the warm slice. Has to have lots of fruit. I think mum used sultanas which are seedless rather than currants or raisins both of which have seeds.

Haggis - I was one of a small group of customers visiting our supplier at Greenock in Scotland. Our supplier arranged a Burn's Night dinner and, piped in by a bagpipe, the haggis was cut open by a sabre and the neeps and tatties accompanied our serving. I'm squeamish and seeing the innards of some animal, tubes and ...... I lost my appetite. The piper was seated next to me, and he passed a bottle of malt Scotch to me and showed how to pour some in a glass and empty it over the haggis, and pour another glass to drink. The more often I repeated this, less worse appeared the haggis.

I've never had one since, but taking a visiting American to Edinburgh some years ago we had a pub lunch and my guest insisted on having haggis. She ate it and enjoyed it, but I think it was a more tourist friendly beast....
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Re: Food Words

by Jenise » Wed Aug 23, 2023 1:10 pm

DanS wrote:I've never heard of RMO called cowboy caviar. I always thought (and a quick DuckDuckGo search) says it is black-eyed peas, black beans, corn, tomatoes, etc.


With Dan here. Cowboy Caviar aka Texas Caviar is black eyed peas (with, at a minimum, chopped jalapenos and onions) as a chip dip. I love it.
My wine shopping and I have never had a problem. Just a perpetual race between the bankruptcy court and Hell.--Rogov
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Re: Food Words

by Jenise » Wed Aug 23, 2023 1:13 pm

Watching The Bear, a lot of kitchen/cookery terms flew around that I needed to define for Bob in order for the progression of things in the kitchen to make sense. I recommended the show to friends who don't cook. They have never mentioned seeing it, which means they tried and hated it. I wonder how much of that had to do with them not understanding so much of the terminology that makes sense to most of us who love to cook and understand professional restaurant protocols to a large degree.
My wine shopping and I have never had a problem. Just a perpetual race between the bankruptcy court and Hell.--Rogov
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Re: Food Words

by Paul Winalski » Wed Aug 23, 2023 1:45 pm

I'd heard that haggis was best enjoyed with single-malt Scotch, the more Scotch the merrier. Closest I've come to haggis were two offal dishes I had in France.

The first was andouillette. I ordered it thinking it was a diminutive form of Cajun-type andouille. It's not--it's chtterling sausage. :shock: It was tasty, but not at all what I was expecting.

The second was shown on the menu as Tête de Porc. I was expecting braised pig cheek meat in some sort of sauce. It was that, but neatly perched on top was the pig's brain and spinal cord. My first thought was, "OMG! Mad Pig Disease!"

-Paul W.
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Re: Food Words

by Jeff Grossman » Sat Aug 26, 2023 3:13 am

I've eaten haggis in Edinburgh a couple of times. It's OK but I prefer black pudding. (Pumpkin likes both.)
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Re: Food Words

by Bill Spohn » Sat Aug 26, 2023 11:26 am

Back in my Scottish country dancing days, we of course used to celebrate Burn's Night which always included haggis, neeps and tatties but the haggis was a version that left out some of the lamb's pluck, (heart, lungs and liver). IIRC the lungs were omitted.

We had two Scottish butchers in town who were very busy at that time of the year turning out haggis for all the people who wanted haggis but I doubt that they sold much for the rest of the year.
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Re: Food Words

by Paul Winalski » Sat Aug 26, 2023 11:56 am

Bill Spohn wrote:IIRC the lungs were omitted.


So they turned out the lights? Probably best not to see what you're eating when it's haggis.

-Paul W.
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Re: Food Words

by Bill Spohn » Sat Aug 26, 2023 5:17 pm

Paul Winalski wrote:
Bill Spohn wrote:IIRC the lungs were omitted.


So they turned out the lights? Probably best not to see what you're eating when it's haggis.

-Paul W.


I was sent to a British run private school here in Canada for a year (intended to 'focus' me by challenging with a curiculum about a year ahead of the government run schools, which were profoundly boring to me at the time). I was a boarder there (but came home on weekends) so got to eat the school food during the week, which is where I sampled such delicacies as snake and pygmy pudding and haggis made with all organs humming.

Took me years after that to manage to tolerate some organ meats - the flavours were anathema to the untrained young stomach, and I am still not a fan of some.At least it worked to motivate me academically and I also learned to play cricket!
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Re: Food Words

by Jeff Grossman » Fri Sep 01, 2023 3:00 am

There's organ meats and then there's organ meats. There's a lot of liver and thymus gland around fancy restaurants, some hearts too, and occasionally tongue. I'll eat those.

Brains aren't bad to the taste but are texturally challenging. I've had them; no urgency to have them again.

The ones on the excretory pathways are the most troublesome. If I'm in the right mood, a mixed grill with kidneys might pass muster.
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Re: Food Words

by David M. Bueker » Fri Sep 01, 2023 7:33 am

Speaking of Cowboy Caviar, there was this in yesterday's Washington Post. This is a gift link, so it should work.

https://wapo.st/44suNtC
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Re: Food Words

by Jenise » Fri Sep 01, 2023 10:48 am

Jeff, you're a lot more flexible than I am. Liver okay, gizzards I like. And that's it. All the rest--NEVER.
My wine shopping and I have never had a problem. Just a perpetual race between the bankruptcy court and Hell.--Rogov
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Re: Food Words

by Paul Winalski » Fri Sep 01, 2023 12:04 pm

Steak and kidney pie (aka snake and pygmy) is an English national dish. My D&D dungeon master and his wife were English.. We took turns providing dinner before the D&D session. They used to serve steak and kidney pie occasionally, but they made a second pie--steak only--for us squeamish Americans. I've never acquired a taste for kidneys and never had a desire to do so.

The Chinese have to be the champions in the offal department. They eat just about all of the pig except its dying squeal.

-Paul W.
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Re: Food Words

by David M. Bueker » Fri Sep 01, 2023 1:14 pm

Paul Winalski wrote:The Chinese have to be the champions in the offal department. They eat just about all of the pig except its dying squeal.


Business trips to China were always a bit of a food adventure. When my usual host said "it's good for health" I knew to not ask for any other details about what I was eating, lest I throw up on the spot.
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Re: Food Words

by Peter May » Sat Sep 02, 2023 6:40 am

Paul Winalski wrote:Steak and kidney pie (aka snake and pygmy) is an English national dish..

It's not as common, mainly because people don't like kidney.

Instead Steak & Ale, Steak & Mushroom, Steak & Red Wine and plain Steak Pies are more commonly seen on restaurant menus.
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Re: Food Words

by Jenise » Sat Sep 02, 2023 12:07 pm

On a very cheffy Facebook food site I participate on (mostly as an observor), someone posted a picture of a really beautiful plate of of paper-thin sliced vegetables (zucchini, yellow squash and carrots) they referred to as a carpaccio. They were immediately slammed by some pedant who claimed that carpaccio--originating from the word 'carne'--HAD to be meat or fish.

But what else do you call it, I asked in defense of the OP. According to Merriam Webster meat or fish is the correct application, but all the same there is no other word for artfully composed non-meat versions. As food and creativity evolve, borrowing words from one method or treatment to include a new way of doing things seems to be totally legit. Over 20 years ago (I've lived in WA for 20 years now and I'm recalling a restaurant visit that occurred before we moved), I ordered a mushroom carpaccio from an appetizer list. I had never heard of a mushroom carpaccio before, but given just those two words I knew exactly what to expect and I was not disappointed. What other word could have done so?
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Re: Food Words

by Paul Winalski » Sat Sep 02, 2023 12:52 pm

That usage of carpaccio reminds me of what happened to the culinary term coulis. Originally it meant the released juices of cooked meats, or a meat-based soup. Now it is a thin sauce made from pureed and strained fruits or vegetables.

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Re: Food Words

by Jenise » Sat Sep 02, 2023 2:57 pm

Should probably mention it in the abuse thread, but a few years ago 'confit' suffered a similar fate. All of a sudden everything was a confit.
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Re: Food Words

by Bill Spohn » Sun Sep 03, 2023 5:26 pm

Peter May wrote:
Paul Winalski wrote:Steak and kidney pie (aka snake and pygmy) is an English national dish..

It's not as common, mainly because people don't like kidney.


Much/most kidney has a very strong organ meat taste that I avoid but I have had the occasional kidney that was excellent and completely lacked the objectionable taste/smell. Brains (which are unaccountably sometimes called sweetbreads, a term I reserve for thymus glands, something I enjoy, do not, in my estimation, warrant the risk however small of getting health issues regarding prions, Creutzfeldt–Jakob disease and such.
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