Restaurant sodium overdose (ranty)

Ok, so Mr/Ms. Indie restaurant owner, you wanna know why I don't eat out more often? Yeah, I know you don't give a rats butthole, but here is my 'lil rant.
A few months ago, my naggy family doc recommended that I start to shape up or commit to a life on hypertension meds. Now i've been fortunate to have made it all these years without much more than a daily multi-vitamin to keep me going, so she sorta got my attention. I've shed approx 20 lbs, amped up my daily exercise and have reduced my daily sodium intake to 1,500 mg or less. Nothing heroic on my part and my blood pressure has dropped to the point the doc is reasonably happy...at least she is no longer nagging me about that and I'm getting threatening emails from both Merck and Pfizer.
Now what really irks me is the lack of lower sodium options when I choose to eat out. Sure, lots of gluten free, meat free, peanut free, high fibre/fibre free shit, GMO free, veganful, all served on whole grain tofu or whatever. But hardly anything with reduced sodium or FSM forbid, sodium free. There are milions and millions of 'Mercans who could benefit from a less heavy hand on the salt shaker and might even buy your product, but independent restaurants don't seem to care to make many of these options available. I'll give chains a pass on this since I hardly ever choose to frequent a chain. So, until your attitude changes, please carry-on without me. I'd spit in your direction, but my mouth is parched from the lunch you served today and can't muster the spittle to do so.

Winger,

Without salt and fats to feed to the public most restaurants would be out of business.

A few years ago, after I went into partnership in a wine shop in Manhattan, I spent more time there than at my home in the Finger Lakes--and I ate out almost daily. It didn't take long for me to add about 25 pounds and to start seeing numbers in blood pressure and cholesterol shoot up, too.

After getting out of the partnership and back home, all has been fixed, but it took a lot of effort to get the numbers down, a much harder task than increasing them was.

I've learned that restaurants are very open to requests from patrons. I always ask for no salt added, grilled rather than fried, hold the sauce, hold the mayo, whatever. Just ask. There is a Chinese restaurant here in town that if you ask for no MSG, they make the dish fresh...takes a bit longer but we don't mind and the food tastes better anyway. I agree with Thomas, because folks who eat at fast food on a regular basis are addicted to the salt and fat.

I understand what you're saying about asking, but at many "hip" places these days you don't have to ask for gluten free, vegan, whatever free...they are prominently offered on the menu like a badge of honor. Why not give the consumer a low sodium option....I guess a fruit salad is always an exciting option.

Redwinger,

As one who is probably destined to be on hypertensive meds for the rest of my life, I hear you and I know what you're dealing with.

Here's my take:

Hypertension is unquestionably a "silent killer" and nothing to trifle with. You really, REALLY want to get blood pressure under control and within normal parameters.

There are several drugs that can put this under control.

That being said, this is one of those things such as "fever" that is a symptom, rather than in and it of itself a disease. Hypertension has lots of possible causes, any one (or combination) of which might apply to any individual.

In my case, the cause is very clearly stress at work. Before I had my current job, I had no problem with hypertension. Now I do. Factors that relieve stress (such as walking or jogging) help me out.

There are other factors that contribute to the hypertension syndrome: overweight/obesity and lack of exercise being two of the biggest factors.

For some people, high sodium levels can contribute to hypertension. I emphasize the FOR SOME PEOPLE. Lowering sodium ion intake only makes sense if you're one of those unfortunate people for whom this contributes to hypertension. I, for example, don't have hypertension that seems to be affected by sodium intake. I don't use salt at table, and I cut it to the minimum in the food I cook. By personal preference and taste, not for medical reasons. Yet I have hypertension that requires medication to keep it under control.

That being said, I know what you mean regarding restaurant sodium overdose. About 30 years ago I suffered a bout of flu. When I'd recovered enough to get out of the house, I went to a Friendly's restaurant and ordered a cup of chicken soup. It was so salty that I found it inedible. I complained about it to the server, who said that it's how they serve their soup. I've never had soup at a Friendly's since.

I also remember several years ago when I bought a bag of Lay's potato chips that said, in a box in the corner of the package "great new taste". My first though was, "I have a bad feeling about this." The chips were almost inedibly salty, to my taste. I've never eaten Lay's chips since then. I buy Utz, who keep salting to a minimum in their potato chip products.

I'd advise making sure that sodium intake is indeed a factor in your hypertension before getting really worried about it.

But to take another tack: over-salting is a cheap cop-out for a restaurant, versus offering true flavor in your food. It's like over-oaking a wine, or dumping lots of hops into beer. And that should be resisted on its own grounds. That it's also potentially harmful for some of those who have to watch blood pressure is all the more reason to avoid over-salting.

Just my 2c.

-Paul W.

To echo Paul, only about 20% of hypertension cases are sodium-responsive hypertension, meaning that for 80% of hypertension sufferers reduction of sodium intake isn't an important factor. In many cases, increasing potassium, calcium and magnesium intake can produce greater effects than reducing sodium. That's why doctors and dieticians will often recommend an increased consumption of leafy greens and whole grains. That being said, I also find many restaurant foods too salty for my taste, but then again I never salt my food at home apart from what I add during cooking.

Mark Lipton

My now controlled hypertension, like that of many over age 60, is isolated systolic hypertension, which is a type of hypertension that is very responsive to sodium levels. In that respect, I am fortunate to be able to use a lowsalt diet as just another tool in my toolbox, along with weight management and exercise. Again, fortunately, I do not have any external stress inducers in my life that require management.

Even if reduced salt only helps 20% of the hypertense, that is still a metric crap load of people in this country. Probably 20 million or so. You'd think those affected would demand a response from the restaurant industry, since no response is apparently voluntarily forthcoming from them. I will simply dismiss the salt-centric approach of some "chefs" as a means to gloss over their lack of talent in the kitchen.

I also agree with Paul and Mark, that once you wean yourself off being a sodium junkie, an use salt as an accent, the food tastes better and you don't miss it...or at least that is my experience.

One final thought, I read someplace on the web, that Americans consume something like 60% more sodium than they did 25 years ago, with processed food being the prime culprit. i find that statistic shocking and it is probably even higher today since that study was a few years old.

Winger

Ever notice how many people have a plate put in front of them and then grab for the salt--without tasting the food first?

Winger
Ever notice how many people have a plate put in front of them and then grab for the salt--without tasting the food first?

You've obviously met my Mom. That said, she's made it to almost 89 years old, of course with a big assist from beta blockers. Her philosophy, which is quite different from mine, is why modify your behavior when all you need to do is take a pill.

[Robin Garr]

fortunately, I do not have any external stress inducers in my life that require management.

Not even the forum!?

Seriously, Bill, good on ya for taking care of yourself. It's mighty easy to let that stuff slide when you get within range of A Certain Age.

Two quick observations:

I once read that when Thomas Edison was considering hiring someone to work in his lab he would invite them to dinner. If they reached for the salt shaker before tasting the food he wouldn't hire them.

My cardiologist once told me that he has several patients who are chefs. He asked all of them how much salt is added to dishes in restaurants. He said he got the exact same answer from all of them, "You don't want to know."

[Jenise]

Winger

Ever notice how many people have a plate put in front of them and then grab for the salt--without tasting the food first?

One certainly sees that in restaurants like Denny's, or any of its equivalents, where food is corporately designed for convenience and mass tastes and the deep fryer never rests. But anywhere there's a real chef in the kitchen, it's rare these days for there to be salt on the table at all. At least out here on the left coast. Regional variations would certainly apply, but in these days of the Food Network and nationally distributed food magazines of which everyone seems to subscribe to at least one, the whole country seems to be getting on the same page about most things. (Which causes me to admit that, travelling in Georgia last month, I was surprised at the extent to which salty/fatty/fried was acceptably normal at virtually all levels of the food chain.)

Perhaps, what you see is a matter of a salt-free table being the mean in the types of places where you dine and not necessarily an overall trend.

Fair enough, though because we travel we dine at a variety of restaurant types in a variety of places. In the two months, Georgia (Atlanta, Athens and coastal islands), Los Angeles, Seattle, Maui and Vancouver, and the meals have encompassed the finest of dining to basic noodle houses and Arab take-out. About the only level not sampled in the last year is the Denny's kind of chain place, which for the reasons Robin mentioned won't have changed since my last and very regrettable visit to a Denny's in Pullman WA last year. Btw, when I was a kid Denny's and their ilk in Southern California were called coffee shops. Nowadays that would make most of us think of Starbucks and certain establishments in Amsterdam--what's the right term for them nowadays, anyone know?

Btw, in the last year we've become reasonably friendly with a couple who are shocked whenever they eat here for dinner to find that I don't put salt and pepper on the table. At home, they each have their own set. They're Canadian-Americans (both grew up in Toronto but have spent most of their adult life in the U.S., for which they're naturalized citizens).

[Robin Garr]

Regional variations would certainly apply, but in these days of the Food Network and nationally distributed food magazines of which everyone seems to subscribe to at least one, the whole country seems to be getting on the same page about most things.

I think it's a question of restaurant genre, maybe, at least here in this between-the-coasts but food-crazy town. Upscale places, bistros, gastropubs, all the restaurants that fill our growing collection of "restaurant rows" and "restaurant clusters," almost never have salt and pepper in sight.

Chains and even locally owned casual family places invariably will have S&P, I think.

And it may even be generational, as I'm pretty sure that some of our fine-dining establishments that serve an "older" clientele will usually have S&P for the sake of tradition, even if their diners may be more likely than most to be watching their sodium.

Perhaps, what you see is a matter of a salt-free table being the mean in the types of places where you dine and not necessarily an overall trend.

Btw, when I was a kid Denny's and their ilk in Southern California were called coffee shops. Nowadays that would make most of us think of Starbucks and certain establishments in Amsterdam--what's the right term for them nowadays, anyone know?

Fast food dumps?

The idea that a restaurant doesn't feel the customer is capable of determining what is proper seasoning for their taste comes across as being quite arrogant to me, even if true. And this is coming from someone who never adds salt at the table unless the chef has the palate of a yak. I haven't encountered one of these snobby places in a while, but next time I do, I'll be sure to request a bottle of Ketchup.

The idea that a restaurant doesn't feel the customer is capable of determining what is proper seasoning for their taste comes across as being quite arrogant to me, even if true. And this is coming from someone who never adds salt at the table unless the chef has the palate of a yak. I haven't encountered one of these snobby places in a while, but next time I do, I'll be sure to request a bottle of Ketchup.

The idea in Italy is that the cook knows how to prepare the food and if it needs salt, the cook will take care of it. In fact, if the diner adds salt, it's an insult to the chef.

[Jenise]

The problem, Winger, is that salt is one component in seasoning and the degree of it creates balance and harmony with other ingredients in mixed ingredient dishes. It's not "snobby" for a chef to salt his or her creations anymore than it's snobby of a painter to use red in a painting. It is, however, something of an art to not use more than one grain than is necessary.

In the meantime, I thought of a definition, though another name for, the coffee shops of old, at least insofar as when salt and pepper are expected to be on the table: any place that serves breakfast!

I once read that when Thomas Edison was considering hiring someone to work in his lab he would invite them to dinner. If they reached for the salt shaker before tasting the food he wouldn't hire them."

http://www.snopes.com/business/genius/salted.asp

The idea that a restaurant doesn't feel the customer is capable of determining what is proper seasoning for their taste comes across as being quite arrogant to me, even if true. And this is coming from someone who never adds salt at the table unless the chef has the palate of a yak. I haven't encountered one of these snobby places in a while, but next time I do, I'll be sure to request a bottle of Ketchup.

The idea in Italy is that the cook knows how to prepare the food and if it needs salt, the cook will take care of it. In fact, if the diner adds salt, it's an insult to the chef.

Thanks, I'll keep that in mind when visiting Italy. Hope they don't mind if I ask for the ketchup.
This whole no salt/pepper on the table is a trend I don't get when a restaurant and chef are supposedly part of the hospitality industry. Still doesn't strike me a hospitable, but like I've said before, what the hell does this hillbilly know.

It's true in France, too: if you're eating in his restaurant then you obviously want to eat his food. If you need the food to be otherwise, go eat somewhere else.

I once read that when Thomas Edison was considering hiring someone to work in his lab he would invite them to dinner. If they reached for the salt shaker before tasting the food he wouldn't hire them."

http://www.snopes.com/business/genius/salted.asp

Dale, this is actually very interesting. It reminds me of several quotes that I've seen attributed to multiple people. But I've always felt that one of them actually had to have said it. Feel the same with this story. Somebody did it. But I'll take IBM off the list for you. I worked there for 34 years and hired a lot of people in that time. I never heard of anyone doing this.

I honestly don't get why this issue warrants a boycott on your behalf. Unlike a person with a food allergy that needs a special menu section (or a knowledgeable server and kitchen) to accommodate what they can and can't eat, you have the luxury of basically having the entire menu to choose from, with a simple "no extra salt" modification. Apart from obvious dishes like brandade, duck confit, etc., most of the seasoning is usually done when the dish is "fired" or plated, not during the prep. It is very easy to request that the kitchen not add any further salt to what you order. And by all means, inquire that the server check with the chef about the level of seasoning in the dish you are looking at ordering if you are worried about pre-existing salt. Avoid lousy restaurants that over salt their food. The ones that actually understand how to season should have no issue with your simple request.