Talking Rye...

So I am trying to do a recipe for an all rye bread. I've got an all rye starter going. The recipe I have asks for rye chops and rye...meal? I think...So far, my research tells me that if I find pumpernickel flour, then I've found the meal.

Chops? That sounds from my reading like the cracked rye berry.

Anyone know where to buy these? I will def. do a Whole Foods check, but if you know something I don't know, I'd love to hear it...

As to why I'm trying it? Why not.

B

King Arthur carries the pumpernickel flour. My local Whole Paycheck does not.

Barb, my grandmother's "everyday" rye used wheat as well, but she had one for all rye that was "special." I'll see if I can dig it up. I make her everyday loaf about once a month just 'cause.

Darn, I wish you lived closer, Barb, and I'd send you some - I have cracked rye in the fridge. You might want to try searching for "Kibbled Rye", which is what cracked rye berries are called here. And isn't rye meal another word for rye flour ? Or is it a thicker grinding ? Good luck - I hope you post pics of your finished loaf !

Celia,

Thanks--yes, rye meal is a coarser grind of rye flour and from my reading, I've learned that pumpernickel flour is generally (but not always; no regulations here) the coarser grind of rye flour. I am heading to WF today to see if I can find rye berries...I also found an online source after googling cracked rye berries...

I had no idea it was going to be such a challenge...but my starter has been working for three days now, so I'm hoping to bakes something wonderful tonight.

b

Barb, I will be watching with great interest ! For the past year, we've baked all our household bread (all sourdough), but have never attempted an all rye loaf, because of concerns about it being very dense. Having said that, I do use rye flour all the time as part of my flour mix, but always keep it in small quantities. I find a little bit of ground malt also makes a delicious addition. Not sure what your recipe says, but a friend of mine who is a miller suggests soaking the grains for a little while first - this softens them up enormously, and makes the end result chewy rather than crunchy. He said that commercial loaves no longer do this, as it takes too long - hence they get the occasional complaint from someone who has cracked a filling on a hard grain !

Well, I struck out with rye berries at Whole Foods. Granted, I went to the smallest WF around here. I drive by a huge WF tomorrow, so I will try to get in to see about rye berries.

My brother has been coaching me through this. All rye-flour bread are not typically made bec. they are too dense and pasty, he says. The combo of the rye flour, meal and chops is what give the loaf some lift. He also uses something he calls a "soaker" which is probably what your baker friend is referring to.

That said, I was only doing it for the challenge. I don't have any aversion/sensitivity to wheat--so I did buy some wheat berries. I will cook/cool those. I think I'll add some oatmeal, the rye starter and some "biga" starter (from the Italian Baker book) that is cooking in my fridge (2008 resolution: always have a starter ready and waiting!)....So. David (brother) says he has some great 60, 70, 80 percent rye breads that may do me better...especially as I wait to get my hands on the meal and the chops...

I'll be blogging it...not yet, but visit to see what I'll be up to with the blog:

http://www.babettefeasts.com

b

Barb,

A challenge is what foodie life is all about !

My main bread resource is a great book by Dan Lepard, a British baker, called THE HANDMADE LOAF. A lot of the temps and oven times are a bit off, but Dan provides errata on his website http://www.danlepard.com. He makes the comment on pg 36 "Both barley and rye lack the stretchy gluten needed to hold the shape of a bold, jaunty loaf. But use them with strong white wheat flour, and let them serve submissively as a background flavour, sour with ry and dusty with barley, and you have the perfect, friendly bread."

Having said that, he has an interesting recipe for a 100% sour rye loaf, which involves making a gelatinized rye mix (basically a paste of rye flour in boiling water)first, to give elasticity to the crumb. Hmm...now you've got me going, I might have to try this...better go build up some rye leaven...

Celia

I love the idea of a "jaunty loaf!" Heh.

My brother keeps referring to Bread, a Baker's Book of Techiniques and Recipes by Hamelman. It is quite the tome.

I've like recipes from Peter Reinhart called Peter Reinhart's Whole Grain Breads: New Techniques

No bread tonight, still, as I have to finish 200 words on tilapia...I don't have that much to say about tilapia...

b

Have just made up my loaf, Barb, wish me luck. I followed the recipe exactly - made a mix of rye and hot water last night to make a "gelatinized rye mix", and mixed that this morning with dark rye flour, salt, water and rye sourdough starter. I honestly have no idea how it's going to go - it looks like a lump of clay ! It's supposed to double in size over five hours, but I'm not optimistic - it doesn't have any of the elasticity or life that I'd normally associate with a yeasted dough. Will let you know how it goes ...

Celia

Well, I'm happy to report the dough DID rise, in fact it had doubled in about 3.5 hours. It DIDN'T rise in the oven though, so whilst it is much wider and larger than it started, it didn't get any oven spring - not sure why. It's a dense loaf, and quite delicious, although I would have been happier if it had a bit more lift. Perhaps that's how a 100% rye loaf is ? Anyway, I used all dark rye flour, maybe next time if I try again I'll use some light rye as well. Thanks for the inspiration, Barb !

100%rye.jpg

rye2.jpg

looks good; you are further along than I am!

Maybe today if I can dig my way out from under the clutter here.

b