What do you do to your bird?

Thanksgiving is right around the corner, and we begin to think about turkey around here. If given the choice, my husband would eat turkey dinner with all the trimmings twice a week at least, so we really look forward to this holiday.

Seems all the articles I read these days on cooking a turkey call for brining the bird and roasting it unstuffed. Well, we tried brining a few years ago and weren't fans. For some reason it reminded us of turkey lunch meat that you buy at the deli counter. We also can't imagine an unstuffed bird. There is nothing like the flavorful, moist stuffing that results. We always get the stuffing to the proper temp and haven't notice overly-dry white meat, as the articles all caution against.

I remember a few years ago, the "way to roast a turkey" was to cover it with a butter soaked cheesecloth. I did that for a few years, then it occurred to me that it seemed much of the browning and flavor ended up on the cloth and not the turkey. Lately, I've been covering the breast and wings tightly with foil. Not tented--otherwise the bird will steam, or so I've read. Then after a few hours remove the the foil to allow to brown. Supposedly, this keeps the white meat and dark meat cooking at approximately the same rate.

I'd love to hear from all of you...
Brined or unbrined?
Stuffed or unstuffed?
Foil tented?
Cheesecloth draped?

I've been happy with turkey cooking bags. Moist, cooks faster and browns nicely.

I usually get a free turkey from somewhere ... one of the advantages of being perpetually indigent ... so I never know what kind of a bird I'm getting, but I find it seldom makes a difference. (I know I'm going to get clobbered for that comment.)

If the bird has not been inoculated with "basting juices" or whatever, then I definitely brine for 4 to 8 hours. The brine is sometimes flavored, sometimes not. Do not brine if the bird has been inoculated. It'll turn into a foul fowl pretzel.

I like to slow roast at 225º F to 250° F for however long it takes to get the internal temperature up to about 165º F. I prefer a large roasting pan which is only about an inch high on the sides to let all the steamy stuff out.

Slow roasting usually precludes the need for a foil tent, but I keep my eye on things and use when needed.

I like a flavorful bread stuffing with homemade, toasty croutons, a mirepoix base, garlic, spices per my mood, and Italian grating cheeses.

And let it rest for at least 20 minutes before carving to keep them juices in.

Turkey ain't hard. It just takes patience ... and a turkey. Both my ex-wives and current significant other have always relegated the turkey-making to me.

I've done turkeys several ways. My mother-in-law will be roasting one for this year's dinner, but I'll be bringing a smoked bird (or breast). I have an electric smoker that I put apple wood in for the smoke. It has a water pan in the bottom that steams as it cooks and collects all the drippings. I use this "broth" to boil down the carcas a few days later and make split pea soup.
As for roasting, one tip I picked up many years ago (from Martha Stewart, I believe) is to roast the turkey, breast side down, on a shallow rack in a roasting pan. This allows juices to flow with gravity and keep the breast moist. Actually I smoke it breast side down also.

We've been doing our turkey like this for years. Perfect every time. I use a zucchini dressing, baked in the oven. When the turkey comes off the grill, I add some of the juices to the dressing casserole.

Here is the method copied from an article on Pandora's Turkey.

Bird specifications: Squatty. You've got to keep that lid closed. A big fat turkey known among chefs as "The Limbaugh" will make this difficult.

Stuffing: Fake stuffing recipe below. Not meant to be eaten. Real stuffing should be cooked separately.

Basting: Don't even think about it. Pandora's Turkey needs to be ignored. One baste, and the deal's off.


Pandora's Turkey

1 turkey (preferably dead) 18 to 22 pounds

2 yellow onions

5 ribs o' celery

2 tablespoons poultry seasoning or dried sage (Do not substitute Hershey's chocolate sauce)

1/2 cup veg oil or melted butter

Salt `n' Peppa (current album)


Did I mention you need a covered kettle-type grill? If you only have a hibachi, just snip off the wings and grill them.

Start with a "clean" grill (this is what the recipe says, but the author could not have foreseen the televised Redskins-Dallas clash, so cleanliness is optional).

Ignite five pounds -- or 5 lbs. (whichever is easier) of charcoal. While you're waiting for the coals to "catch," drive to Vegas to get a bet down on the Redskins-Dallas clash or clean the turkey (whichever is easier).

Cleaning the turkey: Remove neck and giblets from inside bird. Wash bird with cold water. Pat dry with paper towels. Place turkey in heavy-duty, bullet-proof aluminum roasting pan.

Because the coals are still "catching," chop the celery and onions coarsely (this means you may use bad words when you start to cry).

Dump in large bowl, mix with 1/2 cup melted butter and the poultry seasoning or sage. This is called "aromatic stuffing," i.e., to be smelled, not eaten. Stuff it in the neck cavity. Stuff rest in body cavity. No warrant required.

Tie the legs together (most turkeys are born with a "metal fastener"; RPD may use cuffs). Sensuously rub turkey with butter or vegetable oil. Sprinkle with salt `n' peppa.

Turkey should be sitting in roast pan, breast side up.

Guess what? Coals have "caught"! Or you're going to Coco's. Coals should be at that "fine gray ash" stage. Make two piles and shove them to either side (Red Sea effect). Put the grill in place. Put the turkey (in roasting pan) right in the middle. Put the lid on. DON'T TAKE IT OFF. All vents should be open, as required by law.

Without actually singeing your ear, listen for "cooking noises." Soon you will start to smell a "delightful aroma." (This comes from the "metal fastener" that binds the legs together.) In 2 ? to 3 hours, when the turkey has stopped making "cooking noises" and no more smoke is rising from the vents, we will have a new pope. Also, the turkey is done.

Remove the turkey from the grill, lift it out of the pan, let it rest for 15 to 20 minutes. If you'd been sitting in a hot, dark grill with your legs bound together and onions in your neck, you'd need to rest, too.

After you've said, "I told you so" to your closest relatives, especially your mother-in-law, sit down and eat.

Happy Thanksgiving.

Karen, that is the funniest thing I have ever read.
What is it excerpted from? I'm not familiar with Pandora's Turkey...

Oh, you meant AFTER I shoot it!

rwj

That's hilarious, Karen!

We've been doing our turkey like this for years. Perfect every time. I use a zucchini dressing, baked in the oven. When the turkey comes off the grill, I add some of the juices to the dressing casserole.

Here is the method copied from an article on Pandora's Turkey.

Bird specifications: Squatty. You've got to keep that lid closed. A big fat turkey known among chefs as "The Limbaugh" will make this difficult.

Stuffing: Fake stuffing recipe below. Not meant to be eaten. Real stuffing should be cooked separately.

Basting: Don't even think about it. Pandora's Turkey needs to be ignored. One baste, and the deal's off.


Pandora's Turkey

1 turkey (preferably dead) 18 to 22 pounds

2 yellow onions

5 ribs o' celery

2 tablespoons poultry seasoning or dried sage (Do not substitute Hershey's chocolate sauce)

1/2 cup veg oil or melted butter

Salt `n' Peppa (current album)


Did I mention you need a covered kettle-type grill? If you only have a hibachi, just snip off the wings and grill them.

Start with a "clean" grill (this is what the recipe says, but the author could not have foreseen the televised Redskins-Dallas clash, so cleanliness is optional).

Ignite five pounds -- or 5 lbs. (whichever is easier) of charcoal. While you're waiting for the coals to "catch," drive to Vegas to get a bet down on the Redskins-Dallas clash or clean the turkey (whichever is easier).

Cleaning the turkey: Remove neck and giblets from inside bird. Wash bird with cold water. Pat dry with paper towels. Place turkey in heavy-duty, bullet-proof aluminum roasting pan.

Because the coals are still "catching," chop the celery and onions coarsely (this means you may use bad words when you start to cry).

Dump in large bowl, mix with 1/2 cup melted butter and the poultry seasoning or sage. This is called "aromatic stuffing," i.e., to be smelled, not eaten. Stuff it in the neck cavity. Stuff rest in body cavity. No warrant required.

Tie the legs together (most turkeys are born with a "metal fastener"; RPD may use cuffs). Sensuously rub turkey with butter or vegetable oil. Sprinkle with salt `n' peppa.

Turkey should be sitting in roast pan, breast side up.

Guess what? Coals have "caught"! Or you're going to Coco's. Coals should be at that "fine gray ash" stage. Make two piles and shove them to either side (Red Sea effect). Put the grill in place. Put the turkey (in roasting pan) right in the middle. Put the lid on. DON'T TAKE IT OFF. All vents should be open, as required by law.

Without actually singeing your ear, listen for "cooking noises." Soon you will start to smell a "delightful aroma." (This comes from the "metal fastener" that binds the legs together.) In 2 ? to 3 hours, when the turkey has stopped making "cooking noises" and no more smoke is rising from the vents, we will have a new pope. Also, the turkey is done.

Remove the turkey from the grill, lift it out of the pan, let it rest for 15 to 20 minutes. If you'd been sitting in a hot, dark grill with your legs bound together and onions in your neck, you'd need to rest, too.

After you've said, "I told you so" to your closest relatives, especially your mother-in-law, sit down and eat.

Happy Thanksgiving.

Except for the asides, that is pretty much how we BBQ the Bird every year [sans butter and poultry seasoning]....going on 20 years now.

The difference for us is that we rub basil and Extra Virgin olive oil along with a generous portion of sea salt and fresh ground pepper into the skin before cooking.

Adding a cup and a half of water to keep things moist, cover in foil then introduce soaked hickory chips to the coals every so often mkaes for one mighty fine gravy.



Trust me on this one

Karen, I will be doing from one to three turkeys on my Kamado grill this Thanksgiving. and I am definitely going to do one or more of them your way. I am not so sure about that zucchini dressing though. Thanks for posting.

Karen, that is the funniest thing I have ever read.
What is it excerpted from? I'm not familiar with Pandora's Turkey...

About five years ago, an article was in our local paper about Pandora's Turkey. The post I made was from an internet search on such turkey. Recipe is the same but the wording was edited for our newspaper.....pretty much the same story, just better written. The author said that he had done that turkey dozens of times and it was his favorite. The trick is not to let Auntie Hilda or the hot-shot would be chef lift the lid of the Weber. The turkey comes out a mahogany color, moist, and the best thing is that it is out of the kitchen. The guys still stand around it, smelling the wonderful bird cooking, while drinking wine or beer. If it is raining, we just pull it under a long overhang we had built on the side of the garage.

Karen, I will be doing from one to three turkeys on my Kamado grill this Thanksgiving. and I am definitely going to do one or more of them your way. I am not so sure about that zucchini dressing though. Thanks for posting.

It is just a basic dressing with the zucchini added. Adds color and moisture. Last year I found a crock pot dressing, that I rated "excellent" It is made the day before and cooked in the crockpot for three hours. Actually, I make everything ahead of time except for the turkey and spuds. It has taken me 44 years of playing with this dinner to come up with a dinner that is easy on the cook. Of course, as food evolved, I matured with my cooking, and found recipes that my family loved....by george, I think I've got it! Dessert is always different as is the salad. I'm still trying to find perfection!

[Jenise]

No cheesecloth!!!!! Here's my report (from the old FLDG) on my first and only experience with that method:


Date: 24-Nov-2001 17:24
Author: Jenise Email
Subject: Turkey, interrupted
View Parent message

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The 18-pound stuffed, fresh, all-natural turkey went into a 325 degree oven at ten minutes to 1:00 on Thursday afternoon. It was draped in a butter-soaked cheesecloth, the first time I would try this method of turkey roasting.

A little over two hours later, my buddy Annabelle and I were taking a break and trying to talk ourselves into popping cork on that Gosset champagne--after all, this was a holiday--when my one-year old Viking oven suddenly went eerily quiet. The fan had stopped. We stared at each other, brows furrowed, and before we could make a move either in the direction of the Gosset or the oven, an alarm I didn't even know the oven had started beeping furiously. We rushed over to it and found that the digital display no longer announced the temperature, but read "F2".

This was bad. The oven had turned itself off and was swearing at me. So what does a girl do? Goes and wakes her husband up from another one of those post-surgical naps and instructs the buddy to meanwhile open the Gosset. After all, we now had a crisis of considerable magnitude on our hands, and we were going to need help staying calm.

We got out the manual and pored over it, all three of us, and determined (sip, sip) that the oven had overheated. Well, GREAT, maybe we can live with that but we can't live with the beeping. Bob went and cut power at the circuit breaker which helped a lot. In the relative quiet we could ponder what to do. Bob, ever the geek, suggested we go online and see if we could find a FAQ about overheating on the Viking website. The buddy, ever the nurturer, suggested we call the Buttterball hotline--they couldn't help but maybe they'd CARE. I, ever the pragmatist, poured more bubbly.

Thus libated, my cook's instincts finally returned to the fore and I opened the oven door to assess the damage. After all, if the oven didn't come back on I would need to try to finish the bird at a neighbor's and I'd need to estimate the duration of inconvenience. "Call the Pope, it's the Shroud of Turin!," somebody said, on gazing at our bird. Not laughing, intent on my mission, I whipped out my instant-read thermometer. Horrors! The thermometer read 160 degrees! It had only been in the oven just over 2 hours, but Henrietta was done! I read both breasts, both thighs, with the same results. How could this be? And no wonder I got F2'd--THE OVEN HAD INDEED BEEN WAY TOO HOT.

So we pulled the turkey, tented it with foil, and drained away the pan juices, already disturbingly dark, for the au jus. Bob tried the oven and indeed it now came back on, so we returned the turkey to it to rest at 200 degrees for the duration of it's expected 4-5 hour cooking time.

When we carved the turkey around 7:00, we were all quite amazed because this was indeed the very best turkey we'd ever roasted. The dark meat was done perfectly, and the breast meat was so moist, it carved like ham. Whew!

Of course the question remains, what made my oven do that and, though it now operates just fine (an oven thermometer confirms that it's heating and holding temperatures properly), when will it do that again? Yes, that sacred bond of trust between me and my equipment is broken and all the reassurance from Viking in the world (when they finally come back to work and answer my email) won't restore my faith.

What's the moral of this story? Probably isn't one, except maybe--buy analog. Digital's fine for alarm clocks, but not ovens.

Hi Carrie,

I have never actually cooked a turkey for Thanksgiving...so I have no personal experience with it. I have, though, eaten MANY! Mostly bad or mediocre (including my Mom's and my relatives'...where we spend Thanksgiving every yr) However, I lived in Chicago for several yrs and one yr, my future husband and I were invited to a friends for Thanksgiving dinner. There were several peers there who could not be home with their families for the holiday. We were all asked to bring something, and the hosts provided the turkey and a ham. I brought the mashed potatoes and the stuffing, which were quite delicious . Others brought creamed corn casserole (it was just plain awful), various salads and casseroles (this is the midwest you know). The ham was one of those canned hams...ugghhh...just plain disgusting, BUT, the turkey...oh the turkey, was the BEST turkey I have ever had in my life! Even my husband loved it and he hates turkey. So I asked my host what they did (I was pretty shocked since they were both terrible cooks...LOL!). They told me they used Martha's Stewart's turkey recipe...I think it's Turkey 101. I know the turkey was drapped in cheese cloth and it was breast side down. I am pretty sure there was some basting going on as well. Not sure what they put in the cavity (it definitely wasn't dressing to be eaten). I think it was onions and maybe a lemon? I know the bird was not brined either.

My cousin's husband is a chef and he brines his bird every yr. They swear by it, but I have not tasted it, so I can not attest to it's deliciousness.

Anyway, I would be interested in hearing every ones opinions. I bet that Bob's turkey comes out the best though...LOL! Don't think I will get my Kamado in time Bob...haven't heard anything from them yet.

Jenise wrote: Of course the question remains, what made my oven do that and, though it now operates just fine (an oven thermometer confirms that it's heating and holding temperatures properly), when will it do that again? Yes, that sacred bond of trust between me and my equipment is broken and all the reassurance from Viking in the world (when they finally come back to work and answer my email) won't restore my faith."

My answer is that your oven is smarter than you are?

I am scaling back this year, since we will only have 6 or 8 max for Thanksgiving dinner. So, it will be a turkey breast, brined and roasted, with the cornbread dressing cooked separately as always. My Mom was a vegetarian for all her adult life, and so the bird was never stuffed, else she would have had no dressing to eat.

This will be the third brined turkey I've cooked, and now that's all Gail's folks want.

Robert, sometimes there are just four of us, and I never consider scaling back. Thanksgiving leftovers are one of life's greatest pleasures. The more the better.

Not what I do to my bird but what we did to one in a class the other night:





rwj

Robert, sometimes there are just four of us, and I never consider scaling back. Thanksgiving leftovers are one of life's greatest pleasures. The more the better.

Carrie, that is true, but as nobody in the family is particularly fond of the dark-meat turkey, and since neither Gail nor I want to mess with the carcass, the breast is the way to go for us!

We've cooked turkey just about every way mankind has come up with including brining, frying, butterflying, et al. I don't knock any of these methods, but at my age like things quick, simple, and tasty. Picked this one up a year or two ago, and it is definitely a keeper. Don't know why I never thought of using metel screwers in the thighs; duh!

ROAST TURKEY:

15 lb Fresh turkey
Head of garlic, halved crosswise
Lemon, halved crosswise
Salt and white pepper mill
Fresh sprigs of rosemary, thyme, sage (and/or other herbs)
Olive oil

2 Stainless steel skewers
Double layer “tent” of aluminum foil for breast

Wash bird inside and out and pat dry with paper towels. Place on rack in swallow roasting pan. Tuck wings under bird, and insert skewers into thighs. Rub bird with cut faces of garlic and lemon and toss into cavity along with herbs, salt, and pepper. Rub olive oil into skin and season with salt and white pepper. Roast on lowest level of oven at 500 degrees for 30 minutes. Remove from oven and lower temperature to 350 degrees. Put aluminum foil tent over breast, and return to oven. Roast for an additional 2 ½ hours or until internal temperature reaches 160 degrees, turning roasting pan around after 1 ¼ hours. Let stand for 20 minutes after removing from oven.

We have been brining our turkeys for several years now. Usually get it all ready the night before, stick the turkey and brine in a bag, put the bag in a cooler with ice, and put the cooler out on the deck overnight.

Stuffing is made outside the bird, usually by my MIL. We do put things like onions and apples in the body cavity.

Normally we cook the bird on the Weber.

We have been brining our turkeys for several years now. Usually get it all ready the night before, stick the turkey and brine in a bag, put the bag in a cooler with ice, and put the cooler out on the deck overnight.

Stuffing is made outside the bird, usually by my MIL. We do put things like onions and apples in the body cavity.

Normally we cook the bird on the Weber.

Cool.


BBQ is always best


What is your recipe, that is, brine to H2O?

We have been brining our turkeys for several years now. ......................

Normally we cook the bird on the Weber.

Cool.


BBQ is always best


What is your recipe, that is, brine to H2O?

This is what we did last year, from some publication named the Chronicle, I believe but cannot recall for certain:

Brine time: 12-24 hours

1 turkey, about 12 pounds
Brine:
1 cup sugar
1 1/2 to 1 3/4 cups kosher salt
2 1/2 gallons cold water
2 bay leaves, torn into pieces
1 bunch fresh thyme
1 head of garlic, cloves separated and peeled
5 whole allspice berries, crushed
4 juniper berries, smashed


Dissolve the sugar and salt in about a gallon of the water using heat if necessary. Let the water cool. Add the rest of the ingredients EXCEPT the rest of the water, stir. Put the turkey in your brining bag (consider double bagging), pour in the COOLED brine mixture and the rest of the water. Make sure the turkey is totally submerged.....squeeze all air out of the bag, put weight on top, whatever is necessary.

REMEMBER....after removing from brine, pat the bird dry!!! Otherwise excess water will steam the bird, not roast it.

Another thing we did last year (after brining and before cooking) for the first time was take a stick of butter, slice it in half along the length to create 2 thinner pieces. Work your fingers between the breast meat and the breast skin to open a pocket on each side of the breastbone. Slide a piece of the butter into each of these pockets.

Carrie,

We brine and stuff the bird with onions, lemons, blood oranges, garlic, rosemary and thyme. Stuffing is made outside the bird….guess that calling it stuffing in that case is kind of strange..but, oh well.

I’ve always used Emeril’s Brining Recipe and have never had a bird come out tasting like lunchmeat? That’s odd.

Richard