Let's swing BOTH ways

Hmmmmm, la famiglia is thinking of revoking your N.J. Italian license!

If I was posting under my maiden name, I might not have confessed my pineapple obession!

Martha - that is a really interesting story! I would have never thought Mango would be a word for bell pepper...they are not even related (and I don't think they look alike) how strange!

How about green chile, a popular topping here?

Well, Larry, it depends on the kind of green chile. I don't like jalepenos because they taste too much like spicey bell peppers, but I do like pickled hot peppers, banana peppers, peperoncini, jardinier...that kind of stuff on my pizza once in a while. I also put hot red pepper flake on my pizza. I love heat...just not yucky bell pepper flavor...not any colour. (and yes, Gary, I don't like roasted red peppers either...stop clutching your heart...I know I like pineapples and hate roasted red peppers? I can't possibly be Italian! LOL)

Maria: Didn't say I haven't tried it, just that I can't stand it!

I know what I'm missing----and I devoutly hope I keep on missing it for the rest of my life.

That's ok Hoke...more for me...LOL!

I can understand a "no fruit" rule, Richard (I'm firmly in the "pineapple on pizza is a perversion")...but have you ever tried a Gorgonzola and Pear and roasted hazelnut thin crust pizza.

YUM!

Hoke wrote:
I can understand a "no fruit" rule, Richard (I'm firmly in the "pineapple on pizza is a perversion")...but have you ever tried a Gorgonzola and Pear and roasted hazelnut thin crust pizza.


YUM!

well, then, the next time you come to Sonoma, Maria....

It's the place (Red Grape) Barlettano keeps trying to get into, but he hasn't made it yet. Everyone who has tried that particular pizza has absolutely loved it.

Well, Larry, it depends on the kind of green chile. I don't like jalepenos because they taste too much like spicey bell peppers, but I do like pickled hot peppers, banana peppers, peperoncini, jardinier...

No, the green chile we talk about out here is none of those. It's roasted hot chiles like New Mexicans or Big Jim's.

http://www.vivanewmexico.com/food.recipes.cocinas.html

http://web.ecs.baylor.edu/faculty/gravagnei/nmchile.html

Agree will most of the upturn noses with two exceptions.

First, anchovies. This is one of the original toppings after sauce and cheese. The three so called original pizza houses in New Haven, Ct (nobody can agree on the pecking order) all still make this a prominent topping. Besides that, I like them.

Second, sausage. If you are talking about the modern custom of slicing dimes off of sweet or hot Italian sausage or even breakfast sausage, it stinks. The sausage pizza I remember and still make has bits of bulk sweet Italian sausage sprinkled all over the pie. That's great sausage pizza.

My two cents:

Anchovies as a little fishy thing squirming in or on anything I might eat, forget it. They are, however, wonderful as a blended ingredient in the background of many dishes and most of the time you don't even know it, e.g. Worchestershire Sauce. And sausage like pepperoni needs to be rendered before it's tossed on the pie. And I agree that crumbles is and, in my world, always was the way to go.

My two cents:

Anchovies as a little fishy thing squirming in or on anything I might eat, forget it. They are, however, wonderful as a blended ingredient in the background of many dishes and most of the time you don't even know it, e.g. Worchestershire Sauce. And sausage like pepperoni needs to be rendered before it's tossed on the pie. And I agree that crumbles is and, in my world, always was the way to go.

Best use for anchovies is Bagna Cauda (another of those hidden anchovy dishes you allude to), since you have to stir the anchovies in the hot oil until they melt.

Hmmmmm, la famiglia is thinking of revoking your N.J. Italian license!

If I was posting under my maiden name, I might not have confessed my pineapple obession!

Martha - that is a really interesting story! I would have never thought Mango would be a word for bell pepper...they are not even related (and I don't think they look alike) how strange!

How about green chile, a popular topping here?

Well, Larry, it depends on the kind of green chile. I don't like jalepenos because they taste too much like spicey bell peppers, but I do like pickled hot peppers, banana peppers, peperoncini, jardinier...that kind of stuff on my pizza once in a while. I also put hot red pepper flake on my pizza. I love heat...just not yucky bell pepper flavor...not any colour. (and yes, Gary, I don't like roasted red peppers either...stop clutching your heart...I know I like pineapples and hate roasted red peppers? I can't possibly be Italian! LOL)

RE: pineapple. One man's perversion is another man's pleasure.

RE: green chile. It has a totally different flavor profile compared to jalapenos, banana peppers, etc. In NM, green chile is a religion. It's found on everything, including pizzas, hamburgers, subs, etc.

RE: red pepper flakes. I also put them on pizza, even if it has green chile on it.

This reminds me. Many many years (well, decades) ago when I got married we moved that day from the D.C. area to a tiny town in the middle of Appalachian Eastern Kentucky (talk about culture shock!). Our first night out was at the local pizzaria (no chains in that little back woods town). As we were trying to decide what to get on our carry-out pizza, we were surprized to see mangoes on the list of toppings. We were shocked, who would ever want a MANGO on a pizza?!! We were equally surprised when the counter person was surprised that we had never heard of mangoes on a pizza. Is wasn't until about 7 years later we finally learned that mango was a local term for green pepper. However, I still am not crazy about mangoes/green peppers on pizza -- red pepper I like, though.

Back when my mom was growing up in the town of Defiance in northwestern Ohio, green peppers were called mangoes. As a matter of fact, she self-published an autobiography a few years back called, "In Defiance, They Call Them Mangoes".

Mike

I, too, remember areas where they called bell peppers, "mangoes." There's also a confusing overlap with green onions, scallions and shallots, depending on where you live. And, of course, potatoes have been confused throughout history.

When Columbus discovered potatoes after reaching the New World, they were sweet potatoes. References to potatoes during that era always meant sweet potatoes. Even Shakespeare's reference to potatoes really means the orange ones.

About 90 years later, white potatoes were discovered in Peru, which is what started the potato confusion. It wasn't until about 1776, when a British dictionary defined potato as a white one, that the confusion finally started diminishing.

Even today, in the South, white potatoes are referred to as "Irish" potatoes to differentiate them from sweet potatoes.

There. Now I feel better.

Back when my mom was growing up in the town of Defiance in northwestern Ohio, green peppers were called mangoes. As a matter of fact, she self-published an autobiography a few years back called, "In Defiance, They Call Them Mangoes".

Mike

Wow, Mike that's really neat!

Larry - Thank you for your post about potatoes. I did not know that. Very interesting. Now, do you know why they call green peppers mangoes in some areas?

This reminds me. Many many years (well, decades) ago when I got married we moved that day from the D.C. area to a tiny town in the middle of Appalachian Eastern Kentucky (talk about culture shock!). Our first night out was at the local pizzaria (no chains in that little back woods town). As we were trying to decide what to get on our carry-out pizza, we were surprized to see mangoes on the list of toppings. We were shocked, who would ever want a MANGO on a pizza?!! We were equally surprised when the counter person was surprised that we had never heard of mangoes on a pizza. Is wasn't until about 7 years later we finally learned that mango was a local term for green pepper. However, I still am not crazy about mangoes/green peppers on pizza -- red pepper I like, though.

Back when my mom was growing up in the town of Defiance in northwestern Ohio, green peppers were called mangoes. As a matter of fact, she self-published an autobiography a few years back called, "In Defiance, They Call Them Mangoes".

Mike

How very interesting -- it seems Defiance raises a lot of writers. Perhaps it's something in the mangoes?

Agree wholeheartedly on the pineapple - what next, dessert pizza?

Also hate this perverse trend in the US to pack as much carbo and fat into a pizza as you can and then sell it as a feature - cheese filled outer crusts? As some of you will know, there is no way I could ever be poster boy for the heart smart groups (as witness my periodic foie gras events) but needless and tasteless fat and cheese? Why bother.

IMO the best pizza is French - Pisaladiere with black olives, onions(optional but I like them) and anchovies trumps most others for me, though I am not blind to a tastefull concocted gorgonzola and sage, or smoked bacon and asiago, or....

Oh yes - someone please find the idiot that first decided that pineapple and shrimp were a match made in heaven and vulcanise his palate for him.

I've seen ants served on pizza in Italy. They were in the fresh rucola served on top.

Even today, in the South, white potatoes are referred to as "Irish" potatoes to differentiate them from sweet potatoes.

Larry is correct, of course. Irish potatoes are the white ones. But most people are still confused between yams and sweet potatoes too.

And let's not even get into the French, huh? "Pommes de terre"???

Here is something I found a while back that explains the difference between sweet potatoes and yams.

Sweet Potato

Definition: This large edible root belongs to the morning-glory family and is native to tropical areas of the Americas. There are many varieties of sweet potato but the two that are widely grown commercially are a pale sweet potato and the darker-skinned variety Americans erroneously call "yam" (the true yam is not related to the sweet potato).

The pale sweet potato has a thin, light yellow skin and a pale yellow flesh. Its flavor is not sweet and after being cooked, the pale sweet potato is dry and crumbly, much like a white baking potato. The darker variety has a thicker, dark orange skin and a vivid orange, sweet flesh that cooks to a much moister texture. Fresh sweet potatoes are available sporadically throughout the year, though not as readily during the summer months.

Canned and frozen sweet potatoes are available year-round and are sometimes labeled as yams. When buying fresh sweet potatoes choose those that are small- to medium-sized with smooth, unbruised skins. Sweet potatoes don't store well unless the environment is just right, which is dry, dark and around 55 degrees F. Under perfect conditions they can be stored for 3 to 4 weeks. Otherwise, store in a cool, dark place and use within a week of purchase. Do not refrigerate.

Sweet potatoes--particularly the pale variety--can be substituted for regular potatoes in most recipes. They can be prepared in a variety of ways including baking, boiling and sautéing. Sweet-potato chips can now be found on some restaurant menus. Sweet potatoes are high in vitamins A and C. See also potato.

Yams

Definition: This thick, tropical-vine tuber is popular in South and Central America, the West Indies and parts of Asia and Africa. Although sweet potatoes and yams are similar in many ways and therefore often confused with one another, they are from different plant species. In the southern United States, sweet potatoes are often called yams and to add to the confusion, canned sweet potatoes are frequently labeled yams. True yams, however, are not widely marketed and are seldom grown in the United States. Though they can be similar in size and shape to sweet potatoes, yams contain more natural sugar and have a higher moisture content. On the downside, they're not as rich in vitamins A and C as sweet potatoes.

There are over 150 species of yam grown throughout the world. They can range in size from that of a small potato to behemoths over 7-1/2 feet long and 120 pounds. Depending on the variety, a yam's flesh may be various shades of off-white, yellow, purple or pink, and the skin from off-white to dark brown. The texture of this vegetable can range from moist and tender to coarse, dry and mealy. Yams can be found in most Latin American markets, often in chunks, sold by weight. When buying yams, select unblemished specimens with tight, unwrinkled skins. Store in a place that's cool, dark and dry for up to 2 weeks. Do not refrigerate. Yams may be substituted for sweet potatoes in most recipes.

[James Roscoe]

What is allowed on pizza? After the sauce and the cheese that is? Pepperoni, of course (I love the stuff) and sausage (hot Italian). I think that covers the meat that SHOULD be allowed. (I suppose anchovies are traditional for some.) Then you have onions, peppers, mushrooms, and olives. I think that wraps up the vegetables that SHOULD be allowed. I think that is the exhaustive list. I'm sorry for all the gourmets out there, but this is the traditional list as I knew it growing up in Philly.

What is allowed on pizza?

James, I tend to agree with you. I am a pizza minimalist, i.e. sauce with oregano, parmesan and mozzarella, a little red pepper flake ... e basta!

But pizza has a long history. The word "pizza" basically just means "flat bread" and is related to the Greek "pita" and both were around long before anyone brought tomatoes to Italy. Heaven knows what people have been slathering on top or rolling within over the centuries. And even in Italy there are dozens of different pizze. (I remember my joy as a teenager seeing a square of "pizza patate" on the square at the Piazza Navono. Some say it was from this dish that the statues were turning their faces. What a carbo-loader! Heresy, but a delightful sin.)

In any event, tastewise, I'm pretty much with you, but philosophically I guess I'd rather not prescribe what goes on a pie and would answer your original question with, "Whatever tosses your dough!"

"Pommes de terre"???

Literally "apples of the earth". Not to be confused with road apples.

-Paul W.

[James Roscoe]

Gary, you have spent too much time in California. Come on! Fruit on pizza? Broccoli on pizza? What will they think of next, pesto? chili? sushi? (Yes, I realize they put all those things on pizza. The question is, should the pizza police arrest anyone who does it.)

Gary, you have spent too much time in California. Come on! Fruit on pizza? Broccoli on pizza? What will they think of next, pesto? chili? sushi? (Yes, I realize they put all those things on pizza. The question is, should the pizza police arrest anyone who does it.)

Aaaah, Grasshopper, I shall not intrude upon others' pathways to gustatory gladness. Suum cuique, as Cicero supposedly wrote, although I try not to imagine what he was doing at the time.

In my heart of hearts, pizza is simply a lovely discus of wood-oven baked heaven with some tasty, oregano'ed sauce and melted muzzi, no other distractions save a leaf or two of basil, but far be it from me to impose my (probably absolutely correct, eternal and immutable) concept upon the public. Sometimes the road to enlightenment leads past the aberration of a sushi and tofu jalapeño-laced special.

California? It'll be 10 years come September, dude.

[James Roscoe]

Gary, their are places you can get help for diseases like yours.

California is not the only state guilty of crimes against pizza.
It blows my mind to see what they've done to my humble slice back in Noo Yawk.
How about chicken marsala pizza? Salad pizza? Pizza with fried chicken on it?
I have seen these things, my friends, and they displease me greatly.

Thank goodness I still know a few places to go to get an honest slice.

California is not the only state guilty of crimes against pizza. It blows my mind to see what they've done to my humble slice back in Noo Yawk. How about chicken marsala pizza? Salad pizza? Pizza with fried chicken on it?I have seen these things, my friends, and they displease me greatly. Thank goodness I still know a few places to go to get an honest slice.

One of the strangest events in my life was entering a California Pizza Kitchen in the Willowbrook Mall in Wayne, NJ ... not 15 minutes from Tony Soprano's house! It just seemed like such an anomaly ... sprouts and crudités dancing on a pie in the heartland of pizza! Oh, the shame of it!

Still in all, similar to you and James, as much as I personally reject these Frankenpizzas, I still say that they have their place in the wasteland of comestibles for those who are so inclined. We just don't have to eat them.

[James Roscoe]

California is not the only state guilty of crimes against pizza. It blows my mind to see what they've done to my humble slice back in Noo Yawk. How about chicken marsala pizza? Salad pizza? Pizza with fried chicken on it?I have seen these things, my friends, and they displease me greatly. Thank goodness I still know a few places to go to get an honest slice.

One of the strangest events in my life was entering a California Pizza Kitchen in the Willowbrook Mall in Wayne, NJ ... not 15 minutes from Tony Soprano's house! It just seemed like such an anomaly ... sprouts and crudités dancing on a pie in the heartland of pizza! Oh, the shame of it!

Still in all, similar to you and James, as much as I personally reject these Frankenpizzas, I still say that they have their place in the wasteland of comestibles for those who are so inclined. We just don't have to eat them.

Oh, please, don't you have any sense of order? Shoudn't there be a sense of "place" in a pizza. Shouldn't a pizza speak of it's origins? I mean really, do we want fruitbomb pizzas? Stand up for what's right for a change! I know there is a philisophical quote to insert here about good people standing aside and doing nothing, but I can't pull it out of my head. Besides it's all parody anyway.