Kitchen Remodel

Just bought a new house (well, new to me, but quite old in terms of years - about 85 years old.

It had a reno in the 1980s and a lot of the things done are sufficient, but the kitchen, we decided after some reflection, was not, and we have decided to gut it and start again. One of my chief consultants is none other than the famous Jenise, who spent heaven alone knows ho long creating her kitchen and pantry. This one hasn't the space nor the same level of aspiration as hers did, but I thought I'd post some pictures of what exists now and later what I end up with, just for fun (and possible advice. I'll repost here as things develop.

Four comments - that ain't my eagle on the chimney - the previous owner was of Germanic origin and obviously doted on brick, beer steins and eagles. The fireplace isn't going to be moved as it would gain nothing - there is an old hearth and chimney behind it and there is no room to expand the room between there and the existing wall even if you removed it due to proximity to the property line. Third, I don't like the granite counter tops and wouldn't have chosen that colour, so they will end up as paving stones in the garden. Finally, those light 'coffins' suck - so seventies. First thing on the menu is a couple of strips of flush mounted spots and a separate task lighting bar.

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Bill-
That space has loads of possibilities. I'd enjoy seeing what you, Jenise and the contractor come up with.

I once used some excess granite as garden pavers and offer a word of caution. Mine were slick as snot on a doorknob when they got wet and I slipped and fell on my butt twice before I took them up. Slow learner.Perhaps there is some inexpensive non-slip coating that you could apply, but I never looked into that.

Speaking as someone with a kitchen that is 1/10th that size:
- Agreed, the light coffins are just awful.
- Don't knock granite till you've tried it. It is, basically, indestructible. Some folks say you don't ever need a trivet again.
- I like the fireplace. Can you relocate the dishwasher and build something romantic around it - some kind of inglenook?
- What jumps out at me is the lack of knobs. Are you OK to have smudgy fingerprints on every door?

That is a trash compactor not a dishwasher - never understood why people have them since everywhere limits weight, not volume. You can compact all you want but you just end up with a half can of compacted instead of a full can uncompacted of the same weight.

I intend to replace it with a 12 bottle wine cooler so I can have whites ready to go in summer.

Granite is great except in this case I don't like the colour, and the sink is a really stupid design - one large side and one small shallow side with garburetor that spits up at you. I want a 2/3: 1/3 with the same depth on each side - its what we've used for years and it works well.

The main sport will be sitting beside the river watching salmon, eagles, herons.....

Quite exciting I would say !
What about raising that fireplace and hearth to eye level and getting the insert to make a wood fired oven/rotisserie? Perhaps repurposing the fireplace all together into the cooktop area and use the chimney to vent the hood? Simply raising the hearth to eye level and keeping it as a fireplace would give a totally different ambiance.
I would certainly want to take advantage of that wonderful view and would position where you spend the most time in the kitchen facing that view.
Quite agree with you on the lighting and drab granite. Also seems quite inefficient with the long distances and backtracking between fridge-sink-cook areas.
Can you give us a footprint of the entire area ? What is the style of the house and how much do you want the redo to maintain that style?

Plan: http://storage.ubertor.com/cl1018/conte ... 109596.png

Image: http://storage.ubertor.com/cl1018/listi ... 109632.jpg

The style is pseudo Tudor and the house was built in 1932 and added t a couple of times over the years.

The island is too small and has an unnecessary sink/garbureror and insufficient margin between the cook top and the edge. I thought of replacing the induction cooktop with a gas one, but we think more drastic measures are needed to make it a really usable kitchen. I would do all my chopping at the island, looking out at the river!

The lights definitely have to go.

From a strictly personal preference standpoint, I'd consider going with different flooring - cork, wood, etc. - although that would depend somewhat on the rest of the house. I like something softer than stone underfoot.

I'm with you on the granite. Might still go for granite but a different color. What do you think of quartz or some of the other granite alternatives? They offer a lot of choice in color and pattern.

What are you thinking with the cabinetry? What's there strikes me as rather dark and dramatic for a room that appears to get a lot of natural light.

I'm thinking of a lighter colour for the top cabinets or maybe all the cabinets, or could be wood, but maple or something light.

I like the tile in the kitchen, but wouldn't be averse to wood as all the other rooms but one are already hard wood.

Depending on cabinet colour, a dark granite or quartz might look good.

Jenise is coming up for dinner Friday and to look at the house, and will no doubt offer an opinion thereafter!

Quite a bit more difficult for me to comment further in a realistic way after seeing the footprint. With that spectacular view I would want to open up the entire back to cooking and eating and entertaining out and in! Open totally or partly the wall between the kitchen and family room. That would give you lots of extra island space to have an entire prep/cook area. Probably more than you want to get involved in but it seems that the back half of the house is the real "live in" space.
Would also want to know if you often use a formal dining room and if so, opening the kitchen towards the dining room would make for a more efficient flow unless you always have help to serve and schlepp stuff down the hall to the DR.
Another consideration is how often and how many people help you cook ? This would dictate how may task areas you plan.
My kitchen is quite a bit smaller than yours but with 2 separate prep/cook areas. A separate task area in the pantry- lots of counter space and sink has been unexpectedly useful when I entertain for staging and cleanup. You might not have to ditch the induction top but move it to a smaller cook station.

Can't open the family room wall as that room will become my listening room/home theatre and needs to be able to be blacked out in daylight hours.

Can't really open up to the dining room either as there is a hall and bathroom between. Can't post pictures as the site won't allow over 800 pixels wide (or at least that's the message I get when I try).

I usually just have one helper in the kitchen. I'll be replacing the silly sink with little shallow side with a more equal division between sides.

As for the induction cook top, I don't like them the times I've used them and judging by the response when I started a thread on that, neither do others/ I am a gas man!

Sad having to consign a lot of good granite to the garden shed, but c'est la vie. I'll choose a different shade for the new counter tops.

Right now I am having the electrical done - change out the main board for a new one instead of an old main and several sub panels, and sort out the rat's nest of wiring, as well as mapping the house - determining what operates what. Money well spent, I think.

Oh yeah - and installing a couple of 20 amp circuits and 8 new outlets for the stereo gear with hospital grade receptacles so my power amps don't suck all the power with the turn on transient.

Once we get that done, I can start gutting the new wine room so I can have insulation sprayed in the walls.

I agree that the money spent on the electrical is llikely worthwhile. With a house that old that has had a re-do or two, there could be all kinds of interesting wiring in there.

Yeah we found some aluminum wiring which is a pain. I'm having the junctions treated rather than ripping it all out. The problems with it aren't the wire it is where it meets unlike metals in junction boxes etc.

Thankfully we haven't found any remaining knob and tube wiring (like I have in my present house!)

[Jenise]

Also seems quite inefficient with the long distances and backtracking between fridge-sink-cook areas.

Very. It appears to have been designed by/for someone who doesn't actually cook, so large as the kitchen area is, the useful cooking/prep area is narrow and inadequate. In effect, it's a galley kitchen with room leftover for a table and four chairs. The island is NUTS. First thing I told Bill on seeing the pictures is that the stove is downright dangerous--wouldn't have it--and the sink right there is just silly. A second sink is wonderful in a large kitchen but it's not needed at the stove, it's needed at the prep area if there's a prep area remote from the main sink (like I have). If not, junk it.

I get to see it today! Can't wait. Bill, are you bringing champagne?

I get to see it today! Can't wait. Bill, are you bringing champagne?

The Champagne is cooling back at the old homestead, along with a few other bottles to be served blind with dinner!

Looking forward to seeing if my ideas match any of yours once you see it!

The island does strike me as being in a less than ideal location, but I don't know what would be involved with moving it.

Jenise cam by today and we tossed around a lot of things including the island. Conclusion - shorten it a few inches each end for better clearance to the other counters, add a fair bit of with and bevel both outer corners. And make it just an island for work - no sink, no cook top.

[Jenise]

Bill's new kitchen has great potential!

The angled fireplace wall poses a bit of a challenge but the ideas we came up with embraced it, and with lighter cabinets it will actually become a welcome focal feature. He'll put a new range on the wall behind the current island, and the island itself will change in shape from long skinny rectangle to a shorter square. It will be his prep and plating station, so greater functionality and more fluid spaces for moving around. The kitchen will feel twice as big as it does now. He also has a cool mud room just behind the kitchen into which he can add cabinetry for the recycling/trash bins and which will create a counter for an appliance bar like mine--no more appliances on the kitchen counters!

Now he starts the search for appliances. FUN!

Progress report:

After considering all sorts of possibilities, we have opted to replace all appliances and the entire kitchen.

We have obtained a mostly KitchAid assembly of appliances (with lots of input from Jenise) and the existing kitchen is already pretty much ripped out.

I am moving the new range to a different location (the cook top was in the island) and have specified a slightly narrower and deeper (closer to square) island. I have decided to ditch the working 48" Sub Zero fridge as it is old and if it did croak, replacing it would cost more than a small car, or the alternative would be going to a smaller fridge and infilling cabinets.

Only other firm decision is that the new floor will be wood, except for the butler's pantry, which is an entry area and will remain tiled.

The bullet has been bitten, I see.

The bullet has been bitten, I see.

Yeah, it was obviously a kitchen that had taken someone a fair bit of thought, but it was 30 years old and pretty dated. I think Jenise will attest that we made the right choice.

I guess the end result will tell the tale!

Making me think of "the mouse's tale" in Alice in Wonderland.

[Jenise]

The bullet has been bitten, I see.

Yeah, it was obviously a kitchen that had taken someone a fair bit of thought, but it was 30 years old and pretty dated. I think Jenise will attest that we made the right choice.

I guess the end result will tell the tale!

It is definitely the right choice. The things that were imperfect about it created some awkward spaces, and the changes you're making are going to take all the awkwardness out of it. You'll be so happy cooking in your new space; can't wait to see it!

[Jenise]

Bill, you met with the designer on Thursday? How'd that go?