Oak rant......!!!

Why can't all wines be aged in Slovenian oak barrels??????? Can someone PLEASE tell me why? Will all wines be aged in Slovenian oak in heaven? What do you think?

Just had some Barbera D'Alba that could have been delicious had it not been barrique cursed.... I tolerated this wine made by Mascarello (Giuseppe)..... but... I'm tired of tolerating these wines.....

I'm surprised Mascarello uses barrique; they are quite traditional in their oak regime in the Barolos.

As to the more general question, while I am not a fan of lavish oaking, I've never felt that Haut-Brion, Rousseau Chambertin, Roumier Musigny, or LLC suffered from lack of access to Slovenian oak.

I'm surprised Mascarello uses barrique; they are quite traditional in their oak regime in the Barolos.

As to the more general question, while I am not a fan of lavish oaking, I've never felt that Haut-Brion, Rousseau Chambertin, Roumier Musigny, or LLC suffered from lack of access to Slovenian oak.

This Barbera D'Alba "Scudetto" gets 18 months in French barriques according to their website. The barolos, however, do not.

[David M. Bueker]

Why can't all wines be aged in Slovenian oak barrels???????

Ever tried an unoaked Bordeaux blend? I have, and it was completely bizarre.

Slovenian oak can be used in bad ways. I'm sure 100% new Slovenian oak would have its own issues.

[Robin Garr]

Why can't all wines be aged in Slovenian oak

Paulo, I hate to play the pedant (oh, all right, I love to, but one must be discreet) ... are you sure you don't mean <I>Slavonian</I> oak? Slovene (not -ian) oak is used on occasion I'm sure, but the major source of quality wine-barrel oak for Western European wines from the former Yugoslovia is Slavonian, which is in Croatia just down the way a bit from Slovenia.

Why can't all wines be aged in Slovenian oak

Paulo, I hate to play the pedant (oh, all right, I love to, but one must be discreet) ... are you sure you don't mean <I>Slavonian</I> oak? Slovene (not -ian) oak is used on occasion I'm sure, but the major source of quality wine-barrel oak for Western European wines from the former Yugoslovia is Slavonian, which is in Croatia just down the way a bit from Slovenia.

Slavonian..... yes, Robin.... I screwed up...

The point is, of course, that I find it vital to my wine enjoyment, to know how a wine was made, and with what types of oak treatment the wine has gone through. I think it is time to talk about oak treatment on TalkShoe. I am sure you have written about it in one of your Wine Advisor newsletters.....

Why can't all wines be aged in Slovenian oak barrels???????

Ever tried an unoaked Bordeaux blend? I have, and it was completely bizarre.

Slovenian oak can be used in bad ways. I'm sure 100% new Slovenian oak would have its own issues.

Hey, wiseguy, did you mean Slavonian or Slovenian?

Gosh - I don't feel so bad now for mixing up the two if Buecker screwed up!!!

[David M. Bueker]

Just copied and pasted. Wasn't paying enough attention. Slavonian oak usually ends up being part of a very neutral container anyway, so it really doesn't matter does it?

Slovenian oak casks ranging in size from 6,000 to 12,000 liters (approximately 1,584 to 3,168 gallons) are typically used. The Slovenian oak casks impart subtle flavor because of the tightness of the grain, inherent flavors of the wood and the larger ratio of volume of wine to surface area of wood

Salute

Which is the more crucial factor with oak for barrels?

The terroir on which the oak is grown, i.e. Tronçais versus Slavonia versus USA?

or

the type of oak tree, i.e. Quercus Petraea, predominant in French stands, Quercus Robur, the English or common oak, Quercus Cerris, widespred in Eastern Europe, Quercus Alba, the American white oak or other sub-species?

I have always tended to think the latter because it has the greatest influence on the grain.

Does anyone know?

(Anecdotally I have heard that a lot of East European, and particularly ex-Yugoslavian oak has been spoilt by many bullet holes caused by numerous wars.)

No doubt one should consider what type of oak is used to manufacture the oak cask, but also how the oak “is seasoned and prepared” (parameters of toast- light, medium, or heavy toast). These factors will also contribute to the composition of the quality of a wine.

Salute

Slovenian oak casks ranging in size from 6,000 to 12,000 liters (approximately 1,584 to 3,168 gallons) are typically used. The Slovenian oak casks impart subtle flavor because of the tightness of the grain, inherent flavors of the wood and the larger ratio of volume of wine to surface area of wood

Salute

Good point Victor. The volume to surface area is a very important in barrel/cask aging. The smaller the container, the faster the wine absorbs both oxygen and the oak tannins.

Slovenian oak casks ranging in size from 6,000 to 12,000 liters (approximately 1,584 to 3,168 gallons) are typically used. The Slovenian oak casks impart subtle flavor because of the tightness of the grain, inherent flavors of the wood and the larger ratio of volume of wine to surface area of wood

Salute

Good point Victor. The volume to surface area is a very important in barrel/cask aging. The smaller the container, the faster the wine absorbs both oxygen and the oak tannins.

How about Slavonian oak? What flavors do they (can) contribute (in addition to other variables such as age, usage, and toast)?

You wine, Paulo,

We'll talk about oak next week on Saturday at 1PM EDT. Now, find people to talk about it!

(gulp!) OK...... running to NYC for an offline.....

Why can't all wines be aged in Slovenian oak barrels??????? Can someone PLEASE tell me why? Will all wines be aged in Slovenian oak in heaven? What do you think?

Just had some Barbera D'Alba that could have been delicious had it not been barrique cursed.... I tolerated this wine made by Mascarello (Giuseppe)..... but... I'm tired of tolerating these wines.....

You're right to rant, Paulo, but rant not about the oak: rant about those people who subject the wines to such mistreatment!

Hey, I've had bad wine made in Slavonion oak too (and, heck, probably in Slovenian oak as well, for all I know).

But it's not the container: it's the poor decision or the catering to a style that make's a bad wine.

Found this website, some might find it interesting

http://www.thirtyfifty.co.uk/spotlight-oak-barrels.asp

Salute

Found this website, some might find it interesting

http://www.thirtyfifty.co.uk/spotlight-oak-barrels.asp

Salute

This is what I was looking for! Excellent, Victor!! Thank you!