WTN: Two Natural Wines....(short/boring)

These two natural wines showed up at Kokomans last week, so I thought I should impose more punishment upon myself:
1. Fongoli Maceratum IGT: Umbria Trebbiano Spoletino (12.0%; 1985 brls; long skin contact w/ 3 times/day punchdown; no sulfites added; SO2 < 0.10 mg/100 ml; VA: 0.55 gm/litre; TA: 0.57 gm/100 ml; pH: 3.80; RS < 0.10 gm/100 mloli.com; LouisDressnerSlctns) Fongoli/Montefalco/Umbria 2021: Deep amber/rather browning very hazy/cloudy color; strong VM/phenolic/skin-contact/resiny slight orangey rather earthy fairly natty/unclean/bit bretty little fruit nose; slightly off-dry very tart/tangy very sour/acidic quite natty some mousey/unclean rather VM/phenolic no fruit rather tangy/mettalic quite unclean/ugly flavor; very long very sour quite natty/unclean fairly tangy/metallic finish w/ a dreadful wet dog fur aftertaste that goes on&on; a natural wine in its worst configuration; a pretty natty/unclean/undrinkable VM; way overpriced at $32.00 (KK)
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2. Panta Rhei santa Lucia WW Emilia-Romagna (12%; Bombino Bianco; slight skin contact; U/U; no SO2; Scuola di Vino/DalyCity; L.1521) NV:Med.light gold/slight browning quite cloudy/hazy color; very strong unclean/mousey/natty/bretty slight orangey bit dusty/Kansas haymow/herbal quite unpleasant nose; very acidic/very sour very unclean/mousey/bretty/natty bit dusty/haymow no fruit very unpleasant flavor w/ slight austere tannins; very long/lingering very sour/austere very unclean finish w/ a bit wet dog fur aftertaste; the kind of wine that gives natural wine a bad reputation; pretty much undrinkable, leaves a fould taste in your mouth for over 5 min; dreadful stuff; overpriced at $18.50 (KK)
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More pantogorp from the BloodyPulpit:
1. I had pretty low expectations for these wines. They fully delivered on those expectations. Both pretty undrinkable.
I am starting to reach the conclusion that people who love natural wines must have wines that are so unclean & foul and undrinkable that it must have that character for them to feel virtuous & sanctimonius about drinking natural wines. There is no reason on God's green earth that a wine should be on the marketplace that are as bad as these two wines. For a wine to be a natural wine, there is no reason they should taste this bad. You can try any Foradori or Broc wine and understand that can be perfectly clean and do not have to taste bad. But I like to taste wines like this. I can unleash my vitriol in my TN and get my dander up about them. End of rant.
Tom

[David M. Bueker]

My thoughts on natural wines echo my thoughts on sour beers. Occasionally there is a good one, but normally they taste like vomit.

I'm with you and Dave on this issue. There's a reason why the traditional--shall we call them "interventionist"--wine practices have evolved over the centuries. For centuries before Koch and Pasteur came along it was common practice to burn sulfur candles in barrels before using them. Going completely non-interventionist is like doing a high wire act without a safety net. You have to damn well know what you're doing and practice extremely fastidious hygiene, or you're on the road to disaster.

There's over 1000 years of technology out there specifically designed to see to it that wines such as these never happen the way they used to with distressing frequency. In the decades I've enjoyed wine, I've only ever seen one bottle that suffered from ropiness. It was being returned to the wine merchant, who immediately replaced it. He showed it to the rest of us; I think he said it's only the second such bottle he'd ever seen. Has anyone encountered any ropy natural wines?

I've had the privilege of discussing winemaking with several of the top vintners in Burgundy. They all say that they let the wine make itself--until something starts to go wrong. Then they have a large arsenal of rescue operations at their command.

-Paul W.