Two wine competitions for women.

Jancis Robinson's Free for All pages has an interesting item on two wine competitions for women. She makes an interesting point that I hadn't focused on before:

On March 13, 2007, the first-ever National Women’s Wine Competition in the US will single out the Wine Women Want™ based on a blind tasting by an all-women panel of judges. Women buy far more wine than men, yet wine competitions are typically judged by predominantly male panels. Until now.


More details here.

Interesting. I wonder if a less tannic wine will win the overall honors among red wines.

It depends on the background of the judges. If they represent skilled female tasters, then I doubt there will be any more or less contentious choices than any other set of experienced judges.

If they get Diane, Shirley and Edith, who they've persuaded to take part on their way into Wal-Mart for the weekly shop, then I suspect we'd get a different sort of wine altogether. The supermarket shoppers (proportionately high female to male ratio) are the real volume buyers and the wines they buy vary from what's generally discussed here or lauded in wine competitions.

I think they've put 2 and x together and got 4

The principle is one worth pursuing, but the assumptions and spin are lamentable.

regards

Ian

They seem to be addressing your basic issue, Ian.

"Judges will be taken from the ranks of leading women Masters of Wine, sommeliers, wine makers, educators, broadcasters and journalists who focus on wine. Each panel will include a “consumer” judge—a woman involved in the wine industry on a non-professional basis."

I haven't read that "consumer" judges appear on most judging panels, although maybe they do.

There certainly has been a great deal of discussion over the past few years about whether men and women taste wine differently. I'm eager to learn what wines the panels favor. It's certainly true that Janet and I taste wine very differently -- she is much more discriminating, and interested only in what pleases her.

A "two dog" study, of course, of limited, but real value, in my world.

Regards, Bob

There certainly has been a great deal of discussion over the past few years about whether men and women taste wine differently. I'm eager to learn what wines the panels favor.

Interesting, Bob, but won't determine very much, I think.

Any wine judging is an uncertain thing, depending on many variables.

This would be worthwhile to me personally only if they had a panel of males and a separate panel of females taste the same wines and then gauge the results.

And by the way, the judgings I've observed, and participated in, lately are not nearly as male-dominated as they used to be several years ago. I've seen the number of women on wine judging panels rise considerably over the years. Part of that is the increase of women in the field of judges, and part of it is the selection of the judges by the adminstrators (obviously wishing to include more women and seeking out women of merit). A competition that invites only male judges now could be accused of stupid myopic sexism.

I can tell you as one (occasional) wine competition judge that there is little to no sexual discrimination against women amongst the judges I have worked with...they are, simply, wine judges, neither male nor female by necessity. Some of the keenest wine judges I have ever known were women. Also some of the worst were women. But I'd say the same about men. And I think most judges would echo the sentiments.

That National Women's Wine Competition is such a good idea. The world of wine is overly dominated by men - you can tell this by the number of female posters on discussion forums, such as this one - and in competition judging there are very few women involved although there are just as many competent women as there are men, in my opinion.
I once suggested to a competition convenor here that there should be a senior woman judge on every judging panel, but it fell largely on deaf ears as I do believe in every judging panel there should be balance - although sometimes judging panels end up with all male winemaker judges!!!!
Women and non winemaker judges are important and consumers can be excellent judges too. But every judge has to get past a phobia of not liking a wine style (e.g. not liking sauvignon blanc then findng they are on the sauvignon blanc judging panel) and judge each wine on its merits, on its balance, on its expression of varietal character, etc., etc.

Cheers,
Sue

They seem to be addressing your basic issue, Ian.

"Judges will be taken from the ranks of leading women Masters of Wine, sommeliers, wine makers, educators, broadcasters and journalists who focus on wine. Each panel will include a “consumer” judge—a woman involved in the wine industry on a non-professional basis."

I haven't read that "consumer" judges appear on most judging panels, although maybe they do.

There certainly has been a great deal of discussion over the past few years about whether men and women taste wine differently. I'm eager to learn what wines the panels favor. It's certainly true that Janet and I taste wine very differently -- she is much more discriminating, and interested only in what pleases her.

A "two dog" study, of course, of limited, but real value, in my world.

Regards, Bob

Yes Bob, I got caught up in the comment about "women buy more wine than men" bit, which was irrelevent to the piece, but makes good (sic.) journalism, so I ignored the article and treated the headline with disdain.

regards

Ian

Interesting. I wonder if a less tannic wine will win the overall honors among red wines.

!!!!! Why do you say that !!!!!
Do you have some pre-conceived perception about women's palates?

The bottom line is that the tannins have to be in balance to the fruit, the oak, the acidity and everything else in the wine, so it doesn't matter how big they are. There are some mighty fine blockbuster reds out there with humongous tannins but they have humongous everything else too.

Thanks, Hoke, useful data points.

Sounds like there's a little bit of reverse discrimination going down.

Looking at the list of Australian wine judges, though, it appears that about 25% are women, based on guessing from their first names alone.

If women represent 70% of the purchase decision makers, wouldn't it make sense to have a ratio of 70/30 women/men judges?

......The world of wine is overly dominated by men - you can tell this by the number of female posters on discussion forums, such as this one - and in competition judging there are very few women involved although there are just as many competent women as there are men, in my opinion....

Years ago I played in chess tournaments on a regular basis. I still play on line occasionally, but the chess world is also dominated by males, although there are some female players of repute. I don't know why this is so either, or if the two observations are related in any way.

Sue,
I was thinking that possibly women are more sensitive to big tannins than men. I think I am anyway. For example, in general I prefer Pinot Noirs over California Cabernet Sauvignon unless the Cabs have sufficient age on them to tone down the tannic harshness. It is difficult for me to judge the potential of a Cal Cab when it is just released. Similarly, a young Bordeaux with a high percentage of Cabernet Sauvignon in the blend may seem harsh to me and I am more drawn toward Bordeaux wines with sufficient Merlot to soften the palate.
My comment may have been hasty because experienced women judges probably do recognize the potential in younger wines and allow for the balance that will win out in the end.

Interesting question on the Wine Women Awards page.

"Which type of wine do you serve with a dry goat cheese:

A tannic red
A dry and nervous white
A round white "

I've always served goats cheese successfully with sauvignon blanc. Now would this be classified as 'a dry and nervous white', or 'a round white'.
Most of the sauvignon blancs I drink would not be dry and nervous!!!! But then many are not rounded whites either, that is more the chardonnay ilk.

Confused. Or I wonder if something has been lost in translation.

My answer would have been the dry and nervous white which might include Sauvignon Blanc but how about a red Burgundy with Chevre? This is a red but not a tannic red. I'm wondering if by "nervous" they mean acidic or edgy?

Howie, I've often thought about that as well. Susan Polgar has an explanation; if she's right, there shouldn't be any obvious relationship between male domination in chess and in wine.

You started the Susan Polgar Foundation to encourage children, especially girls, to play chess. How and why do you think the game encourages academic smarts? Is there a place in the chess world for kids who want to learn about the game but not devote massive amounts of time to studying it?

This is a very good question! Countless studies have shown that chess can help develop critical thinking that can be used in other areas of a child's life, academics and social situations.

According to research: "Test scores improved by 17.3% for students regularly engaged in chess classes, compared with only 4.6% for children participating in other forms of enriched activities".

In approximately 30 nations across the globe, including Brazil, China, Venezuela, Italy, Israel, Russia and Greece, etc., chess is incorporated into the country's scholastic curriculum.

The following are just some of the benefits of chess:

* Chess develops decision making, critical thinking, logical thinking, evaluating, planning, problem solving, and perseverance skills.
* Chess improves concentration, memory, intuition and self-control
* Chess promotes independence, imagination and creativity
* Chess inspires self-motivation, self-esteem and self-confidence

At my club, some children will take the game very seriously. However, most play because they enjoy it. It is also a place that they can come, make friends and have a good time. We have classes for all levels at different times and days to accommodate everyone.

You, along with your sisters Judit and Sofia, are credited with breaking many of the gender barriers in chess, but there is still a large disparity between the top female and male players in chess. What do you think can be done to ameliorate this situation? Are there inherent differences in chess-playing skill by gender, or is it simply that fewer females enter and stay in the game competitively?

There is no reason why women cannot compete against men on an equal footing in a given game. However, a woman’s career is a lot shorter due to the fact that she may decide to have a family. There are also some other issues that can affect a woman during a two week long tournament. Many things have to change in order for this to happen. The first thing would be to change in terms of social acceptance. Many girls are still very intimidated playing chess against boys. Their approach to the game is different. Most girls like to play for to have fun while boys are a lot more competitive.

From 1st – 3rd grade, the number of boys and girls playing chess are similar. However, at around 4th grade and up, the number starts to drop off dramatically. That is why I want to change that through the work of my foundation.

See the whole interview on the Gothamist here.

My answer would have been the dry and nervous white which might include Sauvignon Blanc but how about a red Burgundy with Chevre? This is a red but not a tannic red. I'm wondering if by "nervous" they mean acidic or edgy?

Went to the original page in French and the description for number two was "un blanc sec et nerveux", so obviously they use an automatic translator for the English page and the meaning has definitely been lost in translation. I'm with you, acidic or edgy, although literal translations for nerveux from wordreference.com also give excitable and peppy as two alternatives. I would definitely put sauv blanc in the dry and nervous category then.

My answer would have been the dry and nervous white which might include Sauvignon Blanc but how about a red Burgundy with Chevre? This is a red but not a tannic red. I'm wondering if by "nervous" they mean acidic or edgy?

Sue and JC:

It's poorly worded, I think. JC, you're likely right in thinking acidic (such as SB, Sue). The word "nervy" would be better here than "nervous". "Nervous" is a poor translation from the French meaning.

Sue: You may think of your SBs as rounded, but in general (and this question has to be taken in the general sense) SB and goat cheese is a standard match (think Sancerre and Crottin de Chavignol if nothing else), and a good basic question to discover whether the one answering understands some of the basic complementary guidelines of wine and food.

So since the world of wine is dominated by men---you're going to have judgings where men are barred from joining in to...equal things out?

Whenever you get into the question of sex dominant situations, it always seems the immediate proposal is to create an opposing sex dominant situation, rather than equalizing things out....or even better, making the situation as sex neutral, or sex moot, as possible.

Sue, you're speaking of your world, where it's obvious the wine judging world is dominated by men in the best good old boy tradition. Must be a bunch of sexist pigs down there, eh? But I seriously do not believe that is the case in the US. It was, but not any more.

I'd venture to say that Europe is still male-ascendant in terms of numbers, but even there the climate has changed a great deal, and women are more prevalent now (especially in the UK).

I'd even go so far as to say that women now have the pr game down better than the men, in that they are putting on much more of a public face for women being wine arbiters (Jancis, O'Neill, Immer, and others) than men of late.

And I can tell you that here in the US, if you try to come off as a male macho porker, you don't get very far. That would be both stupid and dangerous. Try telling Madeline Triffon or Mary Ewing Mulligan or Rebecca Chapa or Diane Teitelbaum or Debbie Zachareas or Laura de Pasquale or Barbara Ensrud or Sharron McCarthy or Becky Murphy (who has run the Dallas Morning News Wine Competition since its inception) that men are dominant, thereby implying that women should be submissive?, and stand back. Slicing, dicing and extreme humiliation of the one who suggests that would ensue. And it wouldn't be pretty.

Hmm...as a matter of fact, we could stage an exhibition and charge money. It would be similar to some of the games in ancient Rome in the Coliseum. Only bloodier and more vicious.

Sue: You may think of your SBs as rounded, but in general (and this question has to be taken in the general sense) SB and goat cheese is a standard match (think Sancerre and Crottin de Chavignol if nothing else), and a good basic question to discover whether the one answering understands some of the basic complementary guidelines of wine and food.

Hoke,
I thought I said rounded was more of the chardonnay ilk. I think of sauvignon blanc as fresh and bracing - nervy is a perfect word - mind you, some oaky sauv blancs can get a little chardonnay like at times
Cheers,
Sue

Sue: You may think of your SBs as rounded, but in general (and this question has to be taken in the general sense) SB and goat cheese is a standard match (think Sancerre and Crottin de Chavignol if nothing else), and a good basic question to discover whether the one answering understands some of the basic complementary guidelines of wine and food.

Hoke,
I thought I said rounded was more of the chardonnay ilk. I think of sauvignon blanc as fresh and bracing - nervy is a perfect word - mind you, some oaky sauv blancs can get a little chardonnay like at times
Cheers,
Sue

Sue: Just so. I read and responded to quicly. There are several different ways to get "lost in translation"; I think I just displayed one of them.