Wine People Behaving Badly?

Might be hard to believe but Lettie Teague wrote a fairly interesting wine article---well, two actually---about wine people behaving badly. She related stories of people, usually in restaurant situations, exhibiting rudeness and gross insensitivity while trying to get their hosts to pay for the good stuff so they could slurp it down like little piggies.

You know the type...not just the ones with little alligator arms who can't seem to reach their wallets when the bill comes, but the people who order the big buck bottles when they know you'll be sucking up at least half the tab, when you know if it were them, they'd be drinking a modest little Argentinian Malbec.

There was even one story Teague related where a "high profile recent divorcee" down in Palm Beach would aggressively solicit dates for dinner, dine on the finest food and the priciest reserve wines...then excuse herself to the ladies room, never to be seen again.

So what are your stories about those people and your experiences with them? And how did you react?

[David M. Bueker]

Bottle of Pain dinner where a notably wealthy guy brings an $18 bottle of Cotes du Rhone. His date brings nothing. That was about 12 years ago, and he has been excluded from every tasting since, and none of the group has ever gone to a single tasting/dinner he has set up.

I knew a dentist that showed up at a dinner with a bottle of Two Buck Chuck---when TBC was still $2.00.

[David M. Bueker]

TBC was not available in Connecticut back then. At least that would have seemed like a joke.

Bottle of Pain dinner where a notably wealthy guy brings an $18 bottle of Cotes du Rhone. His date brings nothing. That was about 12 years ago, and he has been excluded from every tasting since, and none of the group has ever gone to a single tasting/dinner he has set up.

I'm not sure what a Bottle of Pain dinner is, but what if someone brings an inexpensive bottle to a tasting because they thought it might be interesting/unusual/a good ringer, not just because it was cheap?

I have many more good stories than bad.

As far as restaurants, I can't remember any real horror stories. Maybe because I don't host wine dinners I've never had an issue. Usually the pressure is the other way. I'm the geek, so am handed list, and I see poor options on low end, but much better deals at midlevel but at prices I know my host/ companions aren't used to spending. I usually go for best low option. But twice I've just left table, and given my card to waiter/somm and said please bill this separately. I don't expect others to split or pay for my geekiness. Not talking $500 bottles, just $100 bottles that were great deals when I knew others at table would be happy with $40-50 selections.

My wine groups are established enough that no pikers. The two "serious" groups are all people with cellars, and no chintzers (actually one was established to avoid open offlines where cheapass winehunters would try to "get by,"). The less serious group did have one guy 8+ years ago who would host a Rhone theme at his house (probably $1.5 mill) and bring Paralelle 45. But he's long gone.

I'll also note the difference between a#$hole and someone who is interested but doesn't have a cellar and doesn't have a big income.

Getting back to Lettie Teague's articles (I searched after post). some terrible behavior. But if hosting a dinner, who lets someone else order wine? If you let someone else order something, how could they drink entire bottle?
But it's good to know Bryan Ferry likes good wine (big fan here)

[
I'm not sure what a Bottle of Pain dinner is, but what if someone brings an inexpensive bottle to a tasting because they thought it might be interesting/unusual/a good ringer, not just because it was cheap?

Not David, but idea of a Bottle of Pain event is that it's painful to part with such a bottle Not a "whats a good under $20 bottle" type of event'

But twice I've just left table, and given my card to waiter/somm and said please bill this separately. I don't expect others to split or pay for my geekiness. Not talking $500 bottles, just $100 bottles that were great deals when I knew others at table would be happy with $40-50 selections.

Yes, I've done similar things as I agree it doesn't seem fair to push the extra costs of my enjoyment onto everyone else when they get little from it. But it depends on the crowd, some people appreciate the wines even if they wouldn't usually spend that much money. Others I take more sympathy on because the differences are totally lost on them.

[
I'm not sure what a Bottle of Pain dinner is, but what if someone brings an inexpensive bottle to a tasting because they thought it might be interesting/unusual/a good ringer, not just because it was cheap?

Not David, but idea of a Bottle of Pain event is that it's painful to part with such a bottle Not a "whats a good under $20 bottle" type of event'

Oh, that makes sense. I should have figured that out. But sharing a really good bottle with other wine lovers should be less painful than sharing it with just anyone....

[David M. Bueker]

Joe-the $18 Cotes du Rhone happened to also be crap. He picked it up at the local package store on the way to the tasting.

Didn't think I needed additional backstory, but there it is.

I'm not sure what a Bottle of Pain dinner is, but what if someone brings an inexpensive bottle to a tasting because they thought it might be interesting/unusual/a good ringer, not just because it was cheap?

I think if a person wants to do such a thing, they should also bring a a bottle of something of expected value to demonstrate the contrast of the ringer. However there is also the "curiosity" wine - something that may be on-theme, but from a an area or a winery that most of the participants might be unfamiliar with. Sometimes these can be inexpensive, but tasty.

I wouldn't classify bringing an intriguing though not highly priced wine to a winegeek gathering as being anything negative. A TBC, sure, negative because cheap (this dentist knew how to drink well, and did, but was so super cheap when he was buying that he appalled all his friends.) A Parallele 45 at a geek tasting is either clueless, inconsiderate or a studied insult (although there was a time, alas, when the Parallele was a damned fine bottle).

But I have brought, in the past and to events where few if any people knew of it, a Ruche', and it was appreciated. The cost wasn't the point; the exposure to something different was the point.

I also brought a bottle of modestly priced Friulian Collio Sauvignon Blanc to a tasting. Literally, not one person at the tasting had ever had one, and only a couple of people even knew of the state, much less the DOC. The result was astonished appreciation.

That sort of thing, to me, is not douchiness or insulting to peers and hosts. But ordering a $450 bottle of wine because "I've never had that before and our host said we could order anything we liked."----that's douchiness.

[David M. Bueker]

Our group has never looked down at an interesting wine, but when people are bringing '91 Monte Bello, aged grand-Cru Burgundy and Port from the 1800s a bottle of $18 Cotes du Rhone is a disgusting insult no matter how anyone tries to spin it.

OK, this is kind of off track, but what really gets my goat is the non-wine geeks who (a) don't bring anything better than cheap supermarket wine to social gatherings, but who (b) pour themselves 4-5 ounces of the "good stuff" that someone else brought. I have shared hundreds of bottles of fine wine with my geek friends (theirs and mine) and good manners invariably prevail when it comes to the amount one pours in his own glass. That doesn't strike me as arcane or insider knowledge. A bottle has roughly 25 ounces. If there are 10 people at a party, you shouldn't be pouring more than 2.5 ounces, and probably less than that, since the person who brought a very good wine should get a bit more than his or her "share".

I understand that part of this goes back to the size of a wine pour in an inexpensive restaurant (where such folks often dine), which is probably 5 ounces, often filling a cheap glass 2/3 full. But how about simply noticing how others behave? I've seen people empty a 20 year old bottle before the host--who provided it--has had any. Just rude and greedy, in my view. It shouldn't be relevant, but some of the worst offenders are wealthy.

Bottom line: I only open fine bottles for my geek friends. Otherwise I'll leave feeling grumpy.

[James Roscoe]

At MoCool there is one person who has been coming for years and has become a well known joke for just this kind of behavior. The fact that she is allowed to come back year after year is a testament to the kindness and good nature of the people who run the event.

The worst behavior I've seen is excessive cheapness about corkage. At least in California, corkage tends to be less than the profit margin on the cheapest bottle of wine on the list, and so I see it as a privilege. The restaurant, and certainly the server, who sees none of the corkage, is not making a mint when a wine dinner stays twice as long and opens twenty bottles. The number of folks who try to negotiate the corkage after the fact, or whine when it's not waived if a taste is offered to the staff, is disheartening.