Moderators: Jenise, Robin Garr, David M. Bueker
Patchen Markell
Wine guru
1145
Sat Jan 16, 2016 11:18 am
Ithaca, New York
David M. Bueker
Childless Cat Dad
36001
Thu Mar 23, 2006 11:52 am
Connecticut
Patchen Markell
Wine guru
1145
Sat Jan 16, 2016 11:18 am
Ithaca, New York
Hoke
Achieving Wine Immortality
11420
Sat Apr 15, 2006 1:07 am
Portland, OR
Hoke
Achieving Wine Immortality
11420
Sat Apr 15, 2006 1:07 am
Portland, OR
Patchen Markell
Wine guru
1145
Sat Jan 16, 2016 11:18 am
Ithaca, New York
JC (NC)
Lifelong Learner
6679
Mon Mar 27, 2006 12:23 pm
Fayetteville, NC
Hoke
Achieving Wine Immortality
11420
Sat Apr 15, 2006 1:07 am
Portland, OR
patchen.markell wrote:Ahh, the Savoy Truffle. Wendy Gilbert was the Wusthof-wielding chef, Hoke, and unfortunately she died back in 2004. There aren't a lot of eccentric places like that left in the Chicago restaurant world....
Patchen Markell
Wine guru
1145
Sat Jan 16, 2016 11:18 am
Ithaca, New York
Oliver McCrum
Wine guru
1076
Wed Mar 22, 2006 1:08 am
Oakland, CA; Cigliè, Piedmont
Hoke wrote:I'll join the throng welcoming you back.
Good note, and interesting as well in that I have been of late seeking out the less-to-no-oak styles of red wines, which are not all that easy to find.
The prevalent use of oak in reds has become so common, and commonly expected, that exploring those wine without that over-riding dominant factor---vanilla being the most prominent but not by any means the only one---is a major re-discovery for me.
When you don't rely on oak for your major structure, or at least being a major component, it is an unmasking of flavor and structure which I am finding much more appealling. Acidity, tannin and other structural elements become more significant and the fruit emerges in greater complexity, not just as fresh fruit but as dried fruit, raisiny fruit, candied fruit.
When I did the Fete du Malbec in Cahors a few years ago I tasted several hundred versions of Malbec blends. In one survey tasting we had a 'supermarket Cahors' with no wood, just stainless steel; an old-style massive long-aged malbec in old barrels; another massive one in primarily new barrels; and an outlier of malbec made and aged in specially fashioned terracotta amphorae buried in the ground.
Four radically different Cahors. And the new-oaked monster was the most "soupy" with masking flavors and aromas. The old-oak version was far superior. The non-oaked stainless steel actually came out as young and tender and fruity. But the amphorae version was the scene-stealer. Supple, fruity with great complexity, floral, softer tannins and structure with bite or acridity.
I think the common reliance these days on oak has perceptibly altered our essential tasting expectations for red wine. And not for the better.
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