Dryness scale

Hello all,
I am a graphic artist and I am working on a personal wine guide for myself and my friends/family. I have amassed a ton of information and descriptions on wines themselves, through wine guides and on the net, but I have been unable to find a definitive answer to one question. I am trying to put together scales in my book. For example, a red scale that ranks wines by the amount of dryness and/or body; beaujolais would be on the bottom, cabernet on top and merlot somewhere in the middle. The question is, where does chianti, tempranillo, shiraz, etc. all rank in relation to eachother? I want to use only the major varietals. I also wish to do the same for whites. I'd like to thank all in advance for their help with this. If there is any website or existing publication that you can point me to, please do.

Hello all,
I am a graphic artist and I am working on a personal wine guide for myself and my friends/family. I have amassed a ton of information and descriptions on wines themselves, through wine guides and on the net, but I have been unable to find a definitive answer to one question. I am trying to put together scales in my book. For example, a red scale that ranks wines by the amount of dryness and/or body; beaujolais would be on the bottom, cabernet on top and merlot somewhere in the middle. The question is, where does chianti, tempranillo, shiraz, etc. all rank in relation to eachother? I want to use only the major varietals. I also wish to do the same for whites. I'd like to thank all in advance for their help with this. If there is any website or existing publication that you can point me to, please do.

Paul,
Don't really understand. Which is driest, Beaujolais or cabernet? I can see some sense of "body" but all of the wines you mention are usually dry. It is also easy to mix up dry/sweet with amount of fruitiness. You can have a wine made completely dry but with lots of fruit and it seem to be sweet. Vintage is also a major culprit in body.
Walt

[Robin Garr]

Hello all,
I am a graphic artist and I am working on a personal wine guide for myself and my friends/family. I have amassed a ton of information and descriptions on wines themselves, through wine guides and on the net, but I have been unable to find a definitive answer to one question. I am trying to put together scales in my book. For example, a red scale that ranks wines by the amount of dryness and/or body; beaujolais would be on the bottom, cabernet on top and merlot somewhere in the middle. The question is, where does chianti, tempranillo, shiraz, etc. all rank in relation to eachother? I want to use only the major varietals. I also wish to do the same for whites. I'd like to thank all in advance for their help with this. If there is any website or existing publication that you can point me to, please do.

Paul, the concept is great, but there may be a challenge in its execution, as individual wines may vary widely within the variety. This is doubly so among popular varieties like Merlot and Chardonnay, which may be made anywhere from bone-dry to off-dry, and you can't tell by looking at the label. So any such list will have to carry the caveat that it's only an approximation based on representative examples of the grape.

Somewhere onsite I think I have an old FAQ that offers a sort of quick-reference card to varietal styles. I'll look for it later today and post it, or a link.

What both Walt and Robin said.

Wine is an individual, even if it has the same name as another wine.

You can probably create category scales that cover regional styles and even producer styles, and then maybe plug in examples, but even that will have so many exceptions to it that I simply can't see the percentage in doing it.

Thanks for the replies.

Walt - I meant that beaujolais on the bottom would be the least dry/lightest body and cabernet on top would be most dry/fullest body

Robin - You are exactly right. The scale is not meant for wine connoisseurs, but just a general "foot in the door" kind of thing for introducing wine. It is not meant to be specific, just generalized characteristics of a varietal. For example, you would start with a merlot, because it is middle of the road, and if you thought it was too dry or heavy, you would go down the scale to maybe a pinot noir.

I hope you all understand what I'm trying to do. It is not a professional guide that will be published for profit. J ust something that I want to do in my spare time for my colleagues/family, who don't know much about wine. I do understand the variations in the varietal blends, but I want to keep it simple and easy to understand.

Paul, take a look at Andrea Immer Robinson's Great Wine Made Simple, where she makes a stab at doing this.

She raises several of the points that Thomas and Robin suggest, but also gives a very useful basic structure that covers the leading wines on offer. Here's an extract from my course notes based on a lecture she gave using that book as a resource.

Andrea Robinson General Approach

Taste your way to expertise -- the only way to learn.

The tasting tool box:

Body Styles
Light Bodied
Medium Bodied
Full Bodied

Big Six Grapes
Riesling
Sauvignon Blanc
Chardonnay
Pinot Noir
Merlot/Cabernet Sauvignon
Syrah/Shiraz

Flavor Words
Dry
Crisp
Oaky
Tannic

Over time you will add other words, many of which will somewhat vague; the Toolbox is a foundation.

Learn to taste

Look -- beautiful, shimmers with colors, look against a white background. White wines darken and turn brown as they age; red wines lighten and turn brown as they age. Cause: oxidation -- oxidation causes loss of fruit (like an apple). In young wines, these are the colors to look for:

White
Pale yellow green
Straw yellow
Yellow/gold

Red
Dark pinkish-red
Ruby red
Inky, dark purple

Is the wine light, medium or full. Generally, the darker the color, the fuller bodied the wine. Look down from the top to judge the differences in color.

Swirl the wine around in the glass to vaporize the alcohol. The air borne vapors carry the scent of the wine to your nose. You can taste only four [or five] flavors, but you can smell thousands of scents. The tongue senses temperature, perceives texture or mouth feel. We taste on our tongues; we find flavor through scent. Practice swirling until it is second nature.

Smell the wine. Swirl. Periodically swirl the wine as the alcohol rises. Identify whatever scents you can; experience will teach you additonal scents. Scents can unleash intense emotions and memories.

Taste the wine; take a mouthful and hold it there; swish it around -- it's not elegant but it is very revealing:

Body and texture -- richness and fullness of red wine; lightness and bubles of sparklers.

Taste -- sweetness on the tip of the tongue, bitterness on the back of the tongue; acidity on the sides of the tongue -- a bit tingly and makes your mouth water.

Flavor -- Heat in your mouth sends aromas to your smell center -- identify those you can find.

Balance -- Overall impression -- do all the components -- body, texture, flavors, sweetness, bitterness and acidity -- seem in harmony, seem pleasant?

Quality -- Did you like it? Did the flavor persist in a pleasant way. Did you like it. How much -- nice or wow.

Wine notes: take simple wine notes at first -- avoid being too specific or subjective at the beginning. Add details over time -- walk before you run.

The approach works; Robinson has taught her approach to thousands of people -- restaurant guests, sommeliers, chefs, waiters, bartenders, in a wide variety of restaurants and bars. "The light goes on every time."

The Big Six Wine Grapes -- 80% of all quality wine sold in the US. Great examples can be grown consistently in almost every great wine region in the world. And each can be made in a variety of styles -- these are the wine toddler's basic wines.

White
Riesling -- REES-ling, not RISE-ling.
Sauvignon Blanc -- Sow-veen-yone BLAHNK
Chardonnay -- Shahr-duh-NAY

Red
Pinot Noir -- PEE-no NWAHR
Merlot -- Murr-LOW or Mare-LOW -- your choice -- and Cabernet Sauvignon -- Cab-uhr-NAY Sow-veen-YONE
Syrah (aka Shiraz) -- see-RAW

Tasting the Big Six

Each has a distinctive varietal tastes (in many variations).

Body -- a textual sensation -- weight, richness, thickness in the mouth.
-- skim milk -- watery, runny, skimpy, short taste -- light bodied.
-- whole milk -- thicker, richer, coats your mouth a bit, longer taste -- medium bodied.
-- heavy cream -- dense, thick, clings to your mouth, flavor hangs on -- full bodied.
Important concept in wine; easy to teach; and you can see the difference as well as sense it in the mouth.

Light Riesling Pinot Noir
Medium Savignon Blanc Merlot/Cabernet Sauvignon
Full Chadonnay Syrah/Shiraz

Tastings

1. Taste all six at once -- Complete Wine Course DVD demonstrates. Works perhaps best -- good with novices and experts.

2. Taste only whites in one sitting; reds in another. Works fine too.

Taste about an ounce to an ounce and a half = average glass in a restaurant setting.
Use a spit bucket or any opaque cup.

Steps:

1. Buy your wines -- Robinson has several suggestions at different price points. She urges that you buy all six at the same price point: everyday, moderate and splurge.

2. Set up six glasses on numbered paper with the names of the wines: 1 Riesling, 2 Sauvignon Blanc, 3 Chardonnay, 4 Pinot Noir, 5 Merlot/Cabernet Sauvignon, 6 Syrah/Shiraz.

3. Pour one ounce in the numbered order -- you can go back and have more of any wine you like.

4. Taste the wines in number order.

Riesling -- pale yellow green, mouth watering, refreshing light white wine -- if you pronounce it correctly -- REES-ling -- you have to smile when you say it. Many styles: Germany -- lightest body; Austria and Alsace -- tangiest flavor; California and Washington -- strongest flavor.

Sauvignon Blanc -- great every day wine, ten dollars, match many foods, usually medium bodied. Straw yellow, a little darker than the Riesling, distinctive aroma with lots of punch. Compare with the Riesling -- they are two entirely different aromas. Robinson recommends a wide range of styles from many countries. Try a variety if you like the taste.

Chadonnay -- Darker yellow-gold, full bodied aroma with lots of fruit. Richest, heaviest, best selling white in the US.

Pinot Noir -- Robinson's favorite red -- red wine flavor; white wine texture -- soft, not heavy. Feels like silk in the mouth, lightest red. Look down from the top of the glass against a white background -- you can see through it. Fragrance and flavor are subtle but seductive, luring you back to the glass.

Merlot and Cabernet Sauvignon -- Top selling red varietal wine by far. Grow everywhere, good wines at every price point, consistent. Dark, inky, dark and medium to full body. Scent is stronger and more intense than Pinot Noir. Perhaps over powering for some people.

Syrah/Shiraz -- Syrah is a French classic; Shiraz the Australian version made it a major wine during the past ten years. Easy prices and vibrant flavors. Usually full bodied and dark and purple when young -- scent and flavor are big and saturated.

5. Practice, practice, practice. Lots of fun and you will learn something new every time. Robinson repeats the exercise with her waiters several times a year.

Putting flavors into words -- the most important tool is the cork screw, but ...

Four key words occur over and over again: dry, crisp, oaky and tannic. Examples come up again and again; here is a brief overview of each word. Note: fruity is not a key word because the definition varies from person to person; the concept is discussed in another section later in this presentation.

Dry -- for Robinson this word is the most frustrating; it is used in confusing ways, and very different ways for different beverages. A dry wine is one without sweetness but not one without fruitiness; a dry beer is one with slightly higher alcohol a smoother mouth feel; a dry Champagne is slightly sweet ("sec"). But, since she has to, a "dry wine means without residual sugar (left over) because in the winemaking process fermentation usually turns all the sugar in ripe grapes into alcohol. Most of the Big Six are technically dry wines. Wines with residual sugar are usually made that way to achieve a specific style:

Slightly sweet (off-dry): white zinfandel or German Riesling Kabinett.
Medium sweet: Italian Moscato d'Asti or German Spätlese and Auslese.
Very sweet: dessert wines like Port or Sauternes.

Lack of residual sugar is the winemaker's definition of dry, but it also applies to the taster. From the taster's point of view, dry is the opposite of sweet. For your tongue to taste sweetness, sugar must be present. In a dry wine, there is no perceptible sugar and thus no sweetness. Two things determine the sweetness of wine: grapes and winemaking.

Ripeness of the grapes are at harvest; normally ripe grapes normally make a dry wine because all of the sugar is converted to alcohol; overripe grapes can make a slightly sweet to a very sweet wine because not all of the sugar is converted to alcohol. Raisined grapes produce a very sweet wine because much of the water is evaporated. Finally, a mold called botrytis (bo-TRY-tiss) creates a very sweet wine (e.g. Sauterne where the mold is called pourriture noble, or noble rot).

Winemaking -- can control sweetness by stopping fermentation by lowering temperatures or increasing alcohol. The first method is used for wines with light to medium sweetness like white Zinfandel or Asti Spumante. Adding alcohol or fortifying it can add sweetness.

Crisp or crispy -- tingle, tang, tartness, zing and liveliness of acidity in wine. Very good to have in balance with other components of wine. Acidity depends on two factors: the grape and where the grapes are grown. White grapes and wines generally have more acidity than red grapes and wines; Riesling and Sauvignon Blanc grapes generally have more acidity than Chardonnay. Cooler wine regions tend to produce wines with more acidity; warmer areas produce less acidity -- as grapes ripen, acid levels fall and sugar levels rise. Acid wines taste sharper but also have a somewhat different texture:

low acidity -- soft, plump, smooth feeling in the mouth.
high acidity or crip -- an electrical charge -- tangy, tingly, mouthwatering -- the pucker from a squeeze of lemon.



There's also a thread here discussing dryness in more detail. Here's a link http://www.wineloverspage.com/forum/vil ... ight=immer

Bob,

I've yet to got through the whole thing, but she lost me at "big six grapes." If that doesn't indicate the futility of such an exercise, I don't know what does...

As a graphic artist, perhaps this may be what you're driving at:

This example shows that both Beaujolais and Bordeaux would have 0 sweetness, the Beaujolais higher acidity, while the Bordeaux would have higher tannins. The Riesling, on the other hand shows sweetness (residual sugar), high acitidy and very low tannins. Of course this is only 3-dimensional and does not address other tasing qualities or aromas, which really define a given wine.

[Robin Garr]

Okay, Paul, here's that FAQ I was talking about. It's online in our WineLovers Questionary:

<B>How can I tell if a wine is dry or sweet?</b>

Readers often ask if there's a simple way to tell sweet, light, dry or fruity wines by looking at the label. In fact, save for dessert wines, most table wines are "dry" (unsweet). But some dry wines are more fruity than others, and this fruitiness may communicate itself as slight sweetness.

There are many exceptions, so be aware that this list is only a general guide. But it offers a broad summary of popular wine grapes and types that might help give you a general idea of what's in the bottle:

SWEET: Dessert wines. Port, Sauternes, Cream Sherry. These are strong and very sweet, intended to sip after dinner, not to drink with meals.

LIGHTLY SWEET: German whites, Riesling, Chenin Blanc, Gewurztraminer. "White" Zinfandel.

DRY, FRUITY REDS: Merlot, Zinfandel, Beaujolais

DRY, FRUITY WHITES: Chardonnay

DRY, TART REDS: Cabernet Sauvignon, Pinot Noir, Syrah, many Italian reds.

DRY, TART WHITES: Sauvignon Blanc (Fumé Blanc), many Italian whites.

Howie - Thanks for the graph... that's close to the idea that I had. I would have 2 separate graphs for red & white. But let's put sweet wines such as riesling aside.

Robin - Thanks for the faq, but those are things I already know. For example, you have cab, pinot noir and shiraz as dry, tart reds, and merlot, zin and beaujolais as dry, fruity reds. let's disregard tart and fruity and focus on dry. What I need is a ranking. I know that cab is a full bodied, but pinot noir is light bodied, so they would be opposite ends of the spectrum. Shiraz and merlot fall somewhere in the middle in terms of body. I don't know much about zin, so what I'm asking, is where does zin fall on the scale? where should I place chianti? Montepulciano? Bordeaux, etc.

Thanks everyone for all your help. I'm gaining some really good stuff here!

If you focus only on dry reds, you can't learn anything. The opposite of dry is sweet. None of the reds discussed have sweetness (residual sugar). What they have is varying amounts of acidity and tannins, both of which affect the mouthfeel at least as much as sweetness (as does alcohol level).

Welcome to the forum Paul. I noted your remark about sweet rieslings!!
That will bring a few forumites out to question if all rieslings are sweet!!! Troll time.

I think I opened a can of worms here... maybe it was more complicated than I thought.

Howie - good stuff... I think I'm going to base the scale on acidity and tannins then. Now, what I want to know... without getting crazy... is where do the individual varietals rank on the scale. Just like you had on your chart. You had bordeaux and beaujolais. What about merlot, where would that be? and chianti, where would that be?.. etc etc. I just want popular varietals: cab, merlot, pinot noir, shiraz, zin, amarone, brunello, barolo, bardolino, barbera, chianti, beaujolais, bordeaux, rioja, tempranillo, cotes du rhone, chatneuf du pape, montepulciano, sangiovese, petite sirah, names like that, and not specific regions.

I think I want to deal with sweetness on another chart, and whites on another chart.

I don't think riesling is sweet in a desert wine sense, but from my understanding, it ranks higher on a sweetness scale (has more r.s.) than chard, pinot grigio and sauv. blanc. correct?

Maybe it can't be done, and i'm better off leaving it out?

I think I opened a can of worms here... maybe it was more complicated than I thought.

Howie - good stuff... I think I'm going to base the scale on acidity and tannins then. Now, what I want to know... without getting crazy... is where do the individual varietals rank on the scale. Just like you had on your chart. You had bordeaux and beaujolais. What about merlot, where would that be? and chianti, where would that be?.. etc etc. I just want popular varietals: cab, merlot, pinot noir, shiraz, zin, amarone, brunello, barolo, bardolino, barbera, chianti, beaujolais, bordeaux, rioja, tempranillo, cotes du rhone, chatneuf du pape, montepulciano, sangiovese, petite sirah, names like that, and not specific regions.

I think I want to deal with sweetness on another chart, and whites on another chart.

I don't think riesling is sweet in a desert wine sense, but from my understanding, it ranks higher on a sweetness scale (has more r.s.) than chard, pinot grigio and sauv. blanc. correct?

Maybe it can't be done, and i'm better off leaving it out?

I think sweetness and dryness are two different things, and I also think you can have dryness even when there is sweetness--some late harvest wines illustrate that possibility. For a fuller explanation of where I stand on the issue, take a look at my blog, vinofictions.blogspot.com

I think I opened a can of worms here... maybe it was more complicated than I thought......Maybe it can't be done, and i'm better off leaving it out?

It is very complicated, as Robin pointed out, and there are too many variables: acidity, tannins, amount of and type of oak aging, level of alcohol, vintage, age of the wine, grape variety(ies), etc. For example, one could compare a Beaujolais with a Chianti in which all the variables listed above are the same, except the grape variety; Gamay vs Sangiovese. Both could be very good representatives of their type. Either could pair up nicely with some of the same dishes, but other dishes would call for one of the other (eg. Beaujolais with grilled pork chops, Chianti with chicken cacciatore). I think it would be easier to go with descriptors and tasting experience. Also, I'm not in agreement about the use of the word "Tart" in previous posts here. To me, tart implies sour, which indicates a degree of acidity, whereas "Astringent" or "Tannic" might be better descriptors. As has been pointed out in other threads regarding tasting qualities, astrincency is the mouthfeel one gets from strong, unsweetend tea.

Okay... thanks for your help everyone. I guess it is just impossible to chart, which is why I can't find any existing one. I guess it will be more generalized than I thought. It is going to be a guide for beginners anyway. Maybe they will learn to characterize the wines themselves. I just wanted to get them going in the right direction. I should have enough to go forward. Anyone else who wants to make a suggestion for to guide s welcome to.

Thanks, thomas, your blog was insightful.

I think I opened a can of worms here... maybe it was more complicated than I thought......Maybe it can't be done, and i'm better off leaving it out?

It is very complicated, as Robin pointed out, and there are too many variables: acidity, tannins, amount of and type of oak aging, level of alcohol, vintage, age of the wine, grape variety(ies), etc. For example, one could compare a Beaujolais with a Chianti in which all the variables listed above are the same, except the grape variety; Gamay vs Sangiovese. Both could be very good representatives of their type. Either could pair up nicely with some of the same dishes, but other dishes would call for one of the other (eg. Beaujolais with grilled pork chops, Chianti with chicken cacciatore). I think it would be easier to go with descriptors and tasting experience. Also, I'm not in agreement about the use of the word "Tart" in previous posts here. To me, tart implies sour, which indicates a degree of acidity, whereas "Astringent" or "Tannic" might be better descriptors. As has been pointed out in other threads regarding tasting qualities, astrincency is the mouthfeel one gets from strong, unsweetend tea.

Howie,

I think of "tart" as the first four letters of tartaric acid and that's the sensation I call tart. Then there are those ladies in Amsterdam windows; but I digress. To me, sour is the taste of milk gone bad--I guess that would be malic over the edge and into the microbe-sphere...

I think there is some web site, perhaps its a retail outlet or something, that publishes a chart for each wine they describe. From left to right, it is least to most, and each horozontal line is a characteristic, such as body (lightest to heaviest); acidity (same); sweetness (same); aging potential(same) tannins (same) and style (traditional to modern).
As for ranking the wines by sweetness, I don't know of any, but I do recall a ranking by body weight on the old Wine Spectator site back when it was free, and it is probably still there in the paid version for matching wine to food. I remember it even divided some wines by country or state of origin, eg., Pinot Noir appeared twice, once for California and once for Burgundy, with the Cal being further down the list (as heaviest was at the bottom).

Robin, I know that you have cautionned that there are many exceptions but I must protest against the following generalisation -

"LIGHTLY SWEET: German whites, Riesling, Chenin Blanc, Gewurztraminer, etc."

The outstanding characteristic of both riesling and chenin is versatility with the result that they produce great wines in bone dry, off-dry, sweet and botrytised styles. My guess is that the bone dry styles are economically dominant, at least from these grapes' natural homes, i.e. the Rhine valley and tributaries and the Danube for riesling and the Loire valley for chenin.

By chance, I have just finished an an excellent bottle of bone-dry Vouvray Les Argiles 2004 from François Chidaine, an extraordinary mouth-filling, aromatic and mineral wine from a supposedly "off" vintage for Loire chenin.

Even German whites are mostly "trocken" in the home market, although those exported tend to be off-dry or sweeter.

Howie,

I think of "tart" as the first four letters of tartaric acid and that's the sensation I call tart. Then there are those ladies in Amsterdam windows; but I digress. To me, sour is the taste of milk gone bad--I guess that would be malic over the edge and into the microbe-sphere...

I've always considered the words synonymous. From Dictionary.com:
tart
adjective, -er, -est.
1. sharp to the taste; sour or acid: tart apples.
2. sharp in character, spirit, or expression; cutting; caustic: a tart remark.

sour
adjective
1. having an acid taste, resembling that of vinegar, lemon juice, etc.; tart.
2. rendered acid or affected by fermentation; fermented.
3. producing the one of the four basic taste sensations that is not bitter, salt, or sweet.
4. characteristic of something fermented: a sour smell.
5. distasteful or disagreeable; unpleasant.
6. below standard; poor.
7. harsh in spirit or temper; austere; morose; peevish.
8. Agriculture. (of soil) having excessive acidity.
9. (of gasoline or the like) contaminated by sulfur compounds.
10. Music. off-pitch; badly produced: a sour note.

Howie,

I think of "tart" as the first four letters of tartaric acid and that's the sensation I call tart. Then there are those ladies in Amsterdam windows; but I digress. To me, sour is the taste of milk gone bad--I guess that would be malic over the edge and into the microbe-sphere...

I've always considered the words synonymous. From Dictionary.com:
tart
adjective, -er, -est.
1. sharp to the taste; sour or acid: tart apples.
2. sharp in character, spirit, or expression; cutting; caustic: a tart remark.

sour
adjective
1. having an acid taste, resembling that of vinegar, lemon juice, etc.; tart.
2. rendered acid or affected by fermentation; fermented.
3. producing the one of the four basic taste sensations that is not bitter, salt, or sweet.
4. characteristic of something fermented: a sour smell.
5. distasteful or disagreeable; unpleasant.
6. below standard; poor.
7. harsh in spirit or temper; austere; morose; peevish.
8. Agriculture. (of soil) having excessive acidity.
9. (of gasoline or the like) contaminated by sulfur compounds.
10. Music. off-pitch; badly produced: a sour note.

Correction: I meant lactic not malic--must have had malo-lactic on my brain.

The trouble with words given such a variety of definitions is that they create much confusion. And that list missed sour, as in yogurt/cream (there's that lactic again) but that reference is in the Oxford D.

Seems to me there are two types of fermentation: the one that produces products to consume and the one that produces products to avoid. I can take tartness but I am only a fan of sourness when I eat yogurt. I have never felt that the smell of wine fermenting is a sour smell--perfume is more like it.

When I used sit around with other FLakes winemakers at our monthly dinners, the word sour was used on events in the cellar that led to no good in the bottle...

[Robin Garr]

Robin, I know that you have cautionned that there are many exceptions but I must protest against the following generalisation -

"LIGHTLY SWEET: German whites, Riesling, Chenin Blanc, Gewurztraminer, etc."

Point taken, Tim, although in my (slight) defense I would note that this old FAQ has its roots in some material I put together for a general-interest newspaper in the between-the-coasts US during the 1980s. And by and large, for the typical non-geek reader in the US, I'd assert that it remains applicable for most wines they'll find in most wine shops. More advanced geeks won't be using a list like this anyway!

Howie:

Here's an etymology for the word sour: Middle English, from Old English sur; akin to Old High German sur sour, Lithuanian surus salty

I love the fact that salty is in the lineage. Makes the whole matter that much more confusing.

Holmes, thanks for the info, I checked out the ABC's of wine on the WS website. I was unable to find any type of scale, but you do present another question for me. You said that Pinot Noirs are heavier in Cali, but Lighter in burgundy. Does the same go for other varietals? I do know that the shiraz from Australia has more body than other syrahs because of cabernet blending. So I guess the question is... if I were to draw up a scale such as the one you described from WS, and we used the varietal Merlot. Is there a general difference between merlots from california, france, italy, chile, austrailia? And do the differences apply to most of the varietals such as cabernet and chardonnay? For example, if pinot noir was heavier in california than it is in france, then is cabernet and merlot also heavier? Maybe I would use this as part of the description.