WTN: two Rieslings

2008 Trimbach Riesling. 12.5% alcohol. Pale color with clarity. Faint petrol or nail polish scent. Subtle "sting" on the tongue. Citrus and mineral notes. Dry, crisp a little tart, but still refreshing and welcoming.

2007 Zilliken Butterfly Riesling (labeled medium dry) Rudi Wiest Selection. About $28 at The Wine Merchant, Raleigh. Screwcap. 11% alcohol by volume. Pale yellow color. Some petrol on the nose and palate. Too much petrol for my taste and it also tasted unbalanced, as if "suss reserve" had been added to sweeten it. I have one bottle remaining and may try it in a spritzer or white Sangria next summer.

Hi JC -

Thank you for the interesting notes.

Sorry to hear about the 2007 Zilliken Butterfly. I had this wine three years ago (the only Butterfly that I've had), and my impression was that it was respectable, albeit expensive for what it was, and perhaps a bit lower in acidity that I expected it to be. Incidentally, I am a big fan of Zilliken in general, but this is really their entry-level wine, and thus is a far cry from their best wines in terms of both quality and style. Likewise, I am guessing that they use some purchased grapes from elsewhere in the Saar and the Mosel for the Butterfly. For roughly the same price or less, I would definitely buy their Saarburger Rausch Kabinett from virtually any recent vintage instead. (Haven't had the 2010 yet, but I would be surprised if it was not another success story.)

Otherwise, I see that the Wine merchant website shows a 2009 St. Urbans-Hof Ockfener Bockstein Kabinett - a very nice wine -for $18.

At any rate, I would be interested to read if anyone here has had any other vintages of the Butterfly, and what their thoughts were.

[David M. Bueker]

While I am not a regular buyer of the Butterfly Riesling, I would actually suspect you were dealing with some reduction.

I don't think Hano Zilliken uses sussreserve anymore. I might guess that this would be a bit of an awkward time for a 2007 though.

2007 Zilliken Butterfly Riesling (labeled medium dry) Rudi Wiest Selection. About $28 at The Wine Merchant, Raleigh.

Damn! Is that price normal? Seems very high.

Seems high to me after tasting the wine. I do like the Saarburger wines from Zilliken.

I see the Butterfly around for about $18 on occasion. I have never been a big fan of that wine. The Saarburger Rausch Kabinett is pretty good. I would like to try one of their Auslese, but I don't want to ante up the $100.

$100 for Zilliken Auslese? Knew the prices for recent vintages were going through the roof, but yikes.

Just fyi (no affiliation/etc other than being a past customer), HDH in Chicago has 02 Zilliken Auslese at about $32.

Is there a problem regarding suss reserve?

[David M. Bueker]

Is there a problem regarding suss reserve?

Only ideaologically.

Somehow a practice that has been around for a long, long time is now regarded as "spoof" in some circles. Certainly there are better and worse ways to handle sussreserve, but I don't think the baby should be thrown out with the grape juice (so to speak).

Only ideaologically.

Somehow a practice that has been around for a long, long time is now regarded as "spoof" in some circles. Certainly there are better and worse ways to handle sussreserve, but I don't think the baby should be thrown out with the grape juice (so to speak).

OK. Thanks, David. I realize that "ideally" the preferred method for making Riesling with residual sugar would be to allow the fermentation to progress to some desired point, then chill the wine to stop the fermentation and perform a sterile filtration while the wine is still cold. The alternative would be to allow the fermentation to complete until dry and sweeten before bottling, and it seems to me that sweetening with reserved juice would be preferable to sweetening with sucrose. Sterile filtration can be expensive to set up, so I've been using suss reserve, followed by a fine filtration and an addition of potassium sorbate.

[David M. Bueker]

Howie,

For your purposes I would see "native" sussreserve (unfermented juice from the same lot as the wine) to be the ideal.

What you have outlined is the entire spectrum of why Riesling with residual has somewhat fallen out of favor with the cool kids. One way or another a technique needs to be used that is currently considered inappropriate by the taste making cognoscenti.

What you have outlined is the entire spectrum of why Riesling with residual has somewhat fallen out of favor with the cool kids. One way or another a technique needs to be used that is currently considered inappropriate by the taste making cognoscenti.

I assume you're talking about in the US? (Since in Germany the residual sugar riesling fell out a favor a while ago). Anyone in particular?

My read on the recent rise of trocken German riesling in the US is that it offers another way of exploring German riesling but not that something was wrong with the residual sugar style. But I don't read any wine publications, if that's where this discussion has been occurring.

[David M. Bueker]

Well in Germany the cool kids have just been cool for a lot longer.

The rise of dry Riesling to the exclusion (somewhat) of the residually sweet style has not been driven by publications. It's more of an internet phenomenon, driven by a rejection of previously lauded producers. In doing so there has to be a "new god", and while Keller was poised to take that spot his prices are too high to be accessible. So producers like Steinmetz, Lauer, etc are not what's hot.

Overall it's merely another version of what is the coolest thing to drink today. Bordeaux had the top spot, especially around the 2000 vintage. Shortly thereafter it was rejected for California Pinot Noir. Now Burgundy is holding sway. Often the shifts are merely a reaction to something becoming popular (see some of the backlash against 2009 Beaujolais, even from the "cool" producers), but at other times it just a junior high-esque opportunity to find something unique that can provide an excuse to exclude other similar, but deemed less worthy, items. Even a producer held in as high esteem as Krug has felt the bite of internet fashion.

I just find it tiring.

It's more of an internet phenomenon, driven by a rejection of previously lauded producers..

I participate here, Disorder, and I read Berserkers from time to time. (I also read wine-pages occasionally but I don't think you're talking about them, they have a very different approach to German wine). I have noticed the rise in attention to Steinmetz and Lauer, both from people who already appreciated German riesling and from people who just started coming to German riesling. But I can't say I've noticed any significant 'rejection of previously lauded producers'. I guess I just read the wrong stuff.

To a certain extent some people may prefer the Steinmetz, Lauer stuff because they don't want to drink stuff with too much residual sugar (and as you yourself have noted, the 2000s have also been a time of rising sugar with all these warm vintages) for taste reasons/food pairing reasons, whatever. But I haven't noticed anyone saying 'I used to like Prum/Christoffel/Haart/etc/etc but now I just find Lauer far superior.'

As a side note, I've been drinking less German riesling this past year because I tend to go in phases where I concentrate on either German/Austrian whites or Loire chenin, and now I'm back to the Loire. But a recent bottle of 2009 Haart PG Kabinett was so damned good (and so much better than a bunch of recent 09 SUH PGs, kabinett and spatlese) that I may be swinging into a new phase. Haart is top stuff.

Good stuff. We're overdue for another Riesling and Sichuan dinner too.

One would think that using the German technique of sussreserve to “back sweeten” would be the “best” (or easiest) method to “re-establish” nature’s balance. As long as the small amount of unfermented juice held in reserve is “identical” (or as David put it “native”) to the juice that underwent an alcoholic fermentation. By adding a small percentage of this unfermented juice to the wine you are slightly decreasing the alcohol content (due to increase in volume), making it sweeter by adding “natural” grape sugars, and adding juice with the same exact “primary components” (and numbers- pH, TA etc) that the fermented wine had prior to undergoing fermentation.

Salute