WTN: Does Vouvray need RS for perfect balance?

I have several times wondered aloud in the recent past whether Vouvray does not need to be at least demi-sec to achieve perfect balance. I have a similar preoccupation on Mosel. Here is the answer as far as Vouvray is concerned!

Vouvray Le Mont sec 1996 – Huet – Alc.12%. The colour was deepening and the nose had a roundness and depth backing up the aromas of wax, quince, honey and minerals which hinted at a sweeter wine that the palate revealed. Definitely dry, but perhaps not bone dry, medium/full bodied, rich, deep and long with lively mouth-watering acidity and incredibly complex flavours and aromas beautifully focussed into a seamless whole. It compelled emptying the bottle in the search of ever more subtlety. A candidate for my wine of the year to date; 18.5/20.

Anyone wishing to buy a modern Huet sec to find out for themselves will have to choose carefully. Today's sec often (not always) has a lot more residual sugar than this wine did. Recent vintages have 7-15 g/l, with towards the upper end being the norm in 2008 and 2009 (e.g. 2008 Le Haut Lieu Sec, 15.4 g/l). The 2005, 2006 and 2007 (and 2010) tended to yield wines more in the 6-9 g/l range, lower than 2008 and 2009 but still considerably higher than your wine I suspect. Back in the 1990s 3-5 g/l was more typical; I don't have data for this 1996 to hand but I wouldn't be surprised if it was more like 5 g/l.

Vouvray might. Savennieres doesn't.

Anyone wishing to buy a modern Huet sec to find out for themselves will have to choose carefully. Today's sec often (not always) has a lot more residual sugar than this wine did. Recent vintages have 7-15 g/l, with towards the upper end being the norm in 2008 and 2009 (e.g. 2008 Le Haut Lieu Sec, 15.4 g/l). The 2005, 2006 and 2007 (and 2010) tended to yield wines more in the 6-9 g/l range, lower than 2008 and 2009 but still considerably higher than your wine I suspect. Back in the 1990s 3-5 g/l was more typical; I don't have data for this 1996 to hand but I wouldn't be surprised if it was more like 5 g/l.

Interesting. It sounds as if Huet is infringing the toothless EU definitions, which for "sec" is the same as the German "trocken", i.e. up to 9g/l RS against, I think, 7g/l acidity; at lower RS levels, acidity levels must be correspondingly lower. I guess that 2008 acidity was pretty high but 2009 less so; the latter must taste quite sweet. The most recent I have is 2007, I think. I should pull one out.

For my 96, 4-5g/l seems plausible.

Vouvray might. Savennieres doesn't.

Agreed, Hoke. The snag is that, IMHO, Savennières does not have growers of the calibre of Huet, Foreau and Chidaine; with apologies to M. Joly .

Vouvray might. Savennieres doesn't.

Agreed, Hoke. The snag is that, IMHO, Savennières does not have growers of the calibre of Huet, Foreau and Chidaine; with apologies to M. Joly .

What about Baumard?

the question seems to me to involve definitions. 'balance' can only occur if there is a least some of every element noticable. for a wine with less than .5 RS you can have two situations. firstly if it is relatively high in acid, they it isn't balanced. if the acid is not fairly noticable, then there is no point mentioning balance. if there is a lot of one element, we can discuss balance. we usually only discuss balance in relation to cool climate wines that have either a fair amount of acid or sugar. can't remember discusssing balance in relation to chateauneuf du pape.

Vouvray might. Savennieres doesn't.

Agreed, Hoke. The snag is that, IMHO, Savennières does not have growers of the calibre of Huet, Foreau and Chidaine; with apologies to M. Joly .

What about Baumard?

Bill, I'd put Baumard and Closel at the top of the heap in Savennieres, but neither matches IMO the consistency and quality of the three producers Tim mentions. Chidaine might be less established, but the point still holds.

Mark Lipton

No.

I was talking to an ITB friend, and he suggested that the powers that be at Huet are thinking about dropping the secs, or at least making less of them, as they don't feel current weather conditions allow for sec wines that aren't too heavy and high in alcohol. Many vouvray secs are 14.5-15% now, and it's seen as a worry at Huet, supposedly.

I don't know if it's true or not, but climate change is certainly having an impact (as have changing viticulture practices) in many regions. For example, making a 'traditional' kabinet in many German regions is increasingly difficult.

All things being equal, I'd rather have a 13.5% vouvray with higher residual sugar than a 15% sec style. I doubt it's that simple, but as a broad generalization, I say bring on the demi-secs, unless a 'freak' vintage comes along that allows you to make a 'traditional' vouvray sec (or Mosel kabinet).