Ancient Wine Making

[James Roscoe]

Here is an article in the Washington Post about a find in Armenia on the earliest known major winemaking site yet found. I love this stuff. I know the oldest recipe known is for beer, but this goes to show that wine making wasn't far behind. Notice the proximity to Mt. Ararat. While I am not a believer in the literal truth of the first part of Genesis, I do love the coincidences.

Thanks for posting, James. Wouldn't you just love to go there and poke around a bit?

[James Roscoe]

Thanks for posting, James. Wouldn't you just love to go there and poke around a bit?

Only in the summer!

Just heard about this as well (and posted on my side of the wine forum). Fascinating. Indeed, I would love to get there and explore as well.

Best
Rogov

[James Roscoe]

I would love to have been the first person to stomp on grapes and leave the juice in a jar. Who would have thought of such a thing?

I would love to have been the first person to stomp on grapes and leave the juice in a jar. Who would have thought of such a thing?

I can sort of see where wine might have been discovery through a mistake. You know, someone goes out to get some fresh grape juice for a guy and he leaves his half-filled cup in the cave's basement next to the big wall with drawings on it and forgets to wash it for a week or so. Happens to me all the time.

But who first decided they'd try eating a lobster?

Here is another article and pictures on the same winery: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/1 ... ml#s222128. The book "Ancient Wine" by Patrick E. McGovern is also an interesting read about the origins of vitculture.

I would love to have been the first person to stomp on grapes and leave the juice in a jar. Who would have thought of such a thing?

If you have experience trying to keep fresh grape juice around for more than a few days you realize it isn't surprising that wine was 'invented'. What makes me wonder is who first thought of a way to stop grape juice from fermenting. Let's try mixing fumes from this buring chunk of sulfur in the juice.....

[James Roscoe]

I would love to have been the first person to stomp on grapes and leave the juice in a jar. Who would have thought of such a thing?

If you have experience trying to keep fresh grape juice around for more than a few days you realize it isn't surprising that wine was 'invented'. What makes me wonder is who first thought of a way to stop grape juice from fermenting. Let's try mixing fumes from this buring chunk of sulfur in the juice.....

What I wonder about is why they would have wanted to stop the fermentation? A problem for Baptists and other religious prohibitionists across the globe!

I would love to have been the first person to stomp on grapes and leave the juice in a jar. Who would have thought of such a thing?

More likely is that someone, early on, picked a bunch of ripe grapes and placed them in a ceramic container. The weight of the grapes led to some of the ones on the bottom being crushed. One thing leads to another and you get spontaneous semi-carbonic maceration. I'd loved to have seen the looks on the faces of those first people to try drinking the stuff.

Mark Lipton

More likely is that someone, early on, picked a bunch of ripe grapes and placed them in a ceramic container...

I've often thought about such things. Ceramics requires kiln firing, which would require something close to a civilized society. My guess is that wine would pre-date ceramics. Perhaps a wooden vessel of sorts - maybe something like a hollowed out log. Or maybe even an animal skin or a tightly woven basket, sealed with beeswax.

“More likely is that someone, early on, picked a bunch of ripe grapes and placed them in a ceramic container”.

Maybe even before ceramic containers or even baskets or animal skins, maybe just in a natural crevice in a rock (just think of a “rock” bowl).
I could just imagine Fred Flintstone and Barney Rubble just dabbling their fingers in the “wine” that accumulated under the presser of the whole cluster of ripe grapes at the bottom of the “rock bowl”.

Salute

I would love to have been the first person to stomp on grapes and leave the juice in a jar. Who would have thought of such a thing?

I can sort of see where wine might have been discovery through a mistake. You know, someone goes out to get some fresh grape juice for a guy and he leaves his half-filled cup in the cave's basement next to the big wall with drawings on it and forgets to wash it for a week or so. Happens to me all the time.

But who first decided they'd try eating a lobster?

Well I'm sure it wasn't the Israelites because lobster is not kosher.

[James Roscoe]

Lou should know as he was there!

Lou should know as he was there!

Zing, Damn obviously I was at many great moments in history but unfortunately I can't remember them.
Roscoe, pay a little more and get some decent writers.

More on the finds from UCLA at
http://newsroom.ucla.edu/portal/ucla/ch ... 88683.aspx