Ice Wine question?

If harvest is in say 2008, and ice wine is made from grapes in January of 2009, which is the vintage?
I hope I am not showing my ignorance.

thanks
Michael

If harvest is in say 2008, and ice wine is made from grapes in January of 2009, which is the vintage? I hope I am not showing my ignorance.
thanks Michael

Michael, AFAIK a wines vintage is the growing year of the grape(s) making up the wine. If it is otherwise then I think we would be open to a whole bunch of problems. What about wine kept in concrete vats for 3-4 years (or more). would it be the growing year, or the bottling year? I think it is the growing year.

[David M. Bueker]

2008. It has happened many times, and the vintage is always when the harvest would have "normally" occurred.

2008. It has happened many times, and the vintage is always when the harvest would have "normally" occurred.

It happened to me. I paid the grower to let the grapes hang on the vines until they were cold enough to pick for ice wine. I think it was 1997, the year of El Nino. I finally picked them in early January without the deep cold. Pretty nice Late Harvest Vidal.

well it certainly can't be the 'growing season' since in the southern hemishphere this is 50/50 between years.

I have a 1997 ice wine from Bernkastel-Cues in my cellar which was harvested in late January 1998.
I am looking forward to taking David's opinion on ageing ice wine to the test as I have a weak memory of what it
tasted like in fall 1998.

Winfried

[David M. Bueker]

Ah aging ice wine (or eiswein). It is a subject that comes up every year or two. There is of course no real answer because eiswein as we know it is a relatively recent (1983) codification in German wine law. (Note: I will stick to German eiswein as that is what I know well.)

For my personal taste I prefer to drink eiswein on the young side. For me it is all about the purity, intensity and focus of eiswein flavors. I have had some aged examples (15 years+), and while they developed different flavors I never had one where I thought those flavors were better than what a really good eiswein possesses when young. I have a few 1997s and 1998s kicking around the cellar, but that's because of the reluctance to open expensive bottles rather than a specific desire to age the wines.

but that's because of the reluctance to open expensive bottles rather than a specific desire to age the wines.

You make an interesting point that I think about from time to time. Will I be reluctant to open some of my best wines because of the absurd prices that they now fetch (DRC, First Growths, Yquem, etc.)? Its not an issue now since (with a few exceptions) my oldest wines are from the 1980s but it might be an issue in 10 years.

[David M. Bueker]

Trust me Tom - It's an issue now. All of us have got it to some degree or another.

By universal albeit unwritten agreement since the 17th century, the vintage year on wine bottles is always from the calendar year during which the harvest began. Makes no difference when it was completed.

Best
Rogov

By universal albeit unwritten agreement since the 17th century, the vintage year on wine bottles is always from the calendar year during which the harvest began. Makes no difference when it was completed.

Best
Rogov

I'll bet you a beer that it is written (not unwrittten) (particularly in the US).

I'll bet you a beer that it is written (not unwrittten) (particularly in the US).

Knowing the American and EU passion for rules and regulations, I think you'ld probably win the bet. I owe you a beer!! I do think though that Marie Antoinette would have laughed at both of us and insisted on a glass of fine Burgundy red to go with her beloved chevre and strawberries.

Best
Rogov

Sounds like Marie Antoinette had good taste.

Sounds like Marie Antoinette had good taste.

Indeed she did. Her last meal (quite literally) before meeting the guillotine was of strawberries and whipped cream, the strawberries to be dipped into Madeira wine and the whipped cream (creme Chantilly to be precise) to be eaten by dipping her finger into it and then putting the cream to her mouth.

Indeed, the misunderstood queen (she did not say "let them eat cake" but "let them eat brioches") was a woman of fine taste in food, wine and lovers. More, she had special passions for quails en sarcophage, for langoustines in garlic butter, and for tournedos done in the style that later became known as tournedos Rossini (in her case without the artichoke heart but indeed with the foie gras and the demi-glace sauce). It has often been said that her husband's many lovers would have gone quite hungry without her efforts.

It is said, by the way that the Champagne coup was modeled after the shape of Marie Antoinette's breasts. Alas, not true, for her breasts were considerably larger than that. But here we are getting into questions of personal taste and not of absolutes.

Best
Rogov

Marie Antoinette.jpg

My mother bought at an estate auction a very heavy (several hundred pounds) sculpted image (cameo-like but magnified to many times the size) of Marie Antoinette's torso and head possibly of some kind of cement and framed in oval wood frame (cherrywood?). It had the sculpting of her curls and the intricate lace of a neckpiece. A family friend tried to buy it from her for several times what she had paid, but she kept it until her death. My sister really wanted to keep it in the family, but it didn't fit at all with her more contemporary decor and I didn't see myself transporting it 1,000 miles and hanging it in my condo, so it went to the estate auction.