Random Thoughts & Rumblings, part 4

[David M. Bueker]

It really is true that there is more fine and affordable wine out there than ever before. Sure we can moan and groan about the state of the US dollar, but fantastic wine can still be had for under $20, and the amount of sub-$30, fantastic wine is mind boggling. Muscadet, Beaujolais, German Riesling QbA/Kabinett, Côtes du Rhone and yes even Bordeaux are just the tip of the iceberg.

Some guy named Steve Edmunds is making a number of those low-priced gems. The 2007 Bone-Jolly Rosé is a worthy successor to the fine 2006. It’s different (think cherry instead of strawberry), but just as good, and under $20 to boot. There’s also a 2005 Syrah in his latest releases (Parmelee-Hill) that keeps up the streak of outstanding 2005s from Steve. The Parmelee-Hill is also under $30.

Just when you think a wine is face down and headed for the grave it comes back and surprises you like the “dead” guy in the Monty Python movie. Last year the 1998 Muller-Catoir Haardter Mandelring Scheurebe Spatlese was showing lots of green and “catty” aromas and flavors. A bottle last week was all about ripe, pink grapefruit and passion fruit. What was once a monster wine that dominated every thing it came near has since calmed down enough to serve at the table. A wise man once said that the wine will always have the last word.

Wine is made to provide pleasure not angst. The amount of hand-wringing and consternation about certain professional reviews of the 2005 Bordeaux is enough to make one give up wine. Of course it's also good theater.

As far as reviews go, when scores are published for an entire vintage without the benefit of actual tasting notes then the shark has truly been jumped.

I know, it’s only Red Bordeaux, but I like it.

I’m not sure I can have enough half bottles. I don’t finish a bottle in one night, and I don’t eat the same food two days in a row. Half bottles are the perfect solution. Unfortunately the selection of half bottles is about 1% of the selection of full bottles. This is the one area where Bordeaux futures are still a great idea. I can buy half bottles of almost anything I can afford.

I was in a wine shop last week and they had about 15% of the wines for sale bottled under screw cap. There’s real momentum behind alternatives to cork.

Good luck in retirement Jacky Truchot! The world of Burgundy will miss you.

David
Good musings!

I've been looking recently at a few wine prices from 8 years ago and it's really noticeable how many wines in the mid-price level (I guess $20-$40) have gone through the roof in pricing terms. The market certainly does seem to have stretched, with some (admittedly very good) wines, now priced too high. Critical acclaim seems to have it's price!

Halves - yes very much like having halves around, even if only for a decent glass of wine each on a mid-week night. I've got an order lined up soon to get a dozen full bottles and either a dozen (or maybe 2 dozen) half bottles from a merchant that carries a decent selection. Another minor advantage is they're often good 'spacers' in wine fridges!

Also agree on the same food two night in a row - at best leftovers will get dressed up as something else. I guess I have horrific memories of my mom microwaving the same meal (Chicken leg, jacket potato, sweetcorn) for us 5 weeknights in a row. The food was even in the same order on the plate! She could cook well, but the microwave made her incredibly lazy and these days she's not so confident in the kitchen. I guess us kids and our demands on her time had a major part in that progression.

Wine might be different (maybe a tight wine will open up the following night). However variety is a huge part of my interest in wine, so preference would be to have a different wine the following night.

regards

Ian

[Robin Garr]

Great essay, David! Thanks!

I’m not sure I can have enough half bottles. I don’t finish a bottle in one night, and I don’t eat the same food two days in a row. Half bottles are the perfect solution.

I sort of agree, although I liked the short-lived 500ml bottle solution even better.
Since Mary and I both enjoy wine with dinner and generally have similar tastes, we find that even moderate consumption often results in maybe 40 percent of the average bottle being left at the end of the evening. The problem with half-bottles is that they seem just a tad too skimpy. I think I'd almost rather have a 500 and pour some of it out. But you're absolutely right that by modern standards, a 750 is way more than two people can responsibly share, and although I've gotten used to pouring out the leftovers at the end of the evening, it still seems like a small waste.

[David M. Bueker]

I like 500 ml bottles, but most of the time it's just me drinking. It might be nice to be able to buy Riesling and Champagne (Laura's favorites) in 500 ml formats, but 375 ml works well for me most of the time.

Looking forward to trying the '07 Bone Jolly rose.

I too wish there were more half bottles at reasonable prices (especially for nights when Betsy isn't home). I buy, but hard to find. The one place I know in NY with a very substantial 375 selection is 67th Wine on Upper West Side, but their prices mean I'd pay about 80-90% of a 750 at a competitive retailer. I'm ok with 375s at 60-65% of full bottle price, or maybe even 70%.

I'd love to see 500 ml. I only have in a few desserts, and a Radikon.

Thinking of halves, 500s, and leftover wine reminded me of something I was thinking of this weekend.
Betsy and I open a bottle of wine most nights. She has a small glass, maybe two. I tend to have two pours (3-4 oz) with dinner, maybe one more after dinner. Typically we drink about 14-18 oz. Leaving about 1/3 of the wine (though sometimes if we know we might have a little less I might put half straight into a 375 and refrigerate, or open a half).

I generally check on the wine on Day 2 and Day 3 (after that red goes to vinegar crock, white to drain if not used for cooking). I don't think that how a bottle holds up to oxygen is a direct link to aging potential, but I do think it provides a (shaky) data point to some wines.

Some thoughts of some red grapes:
Nebbiolo- good Nebbiolo seems almost impervious to aeration. Tannins seem to integrate, but fruit holds and builds over couple days. Of course, most of these age well too.

Cabernet and Merlot- lower acid versions tend to turn pruney quickly. I don't think that is neccessarily true of how they age, they seem to age on tannins not acids, as lots of ripe vntage Bordeaux age just fine.

Pinot Noir- the least predictable. High acid, low acid, hi/lo tannins, doesn't matter- I can never predict what will be undrinkable and what will be delicious on night 2. Unsure if that performance has ANY relevance to aging.

Cab Franc- this is one where I do think the way they hold might be a good predictor of how they'll age. Good structured CF seems to hold well, lower acid ones seem to fall off a cliff.

Tempranillo, Syrah, Gamay- closer to CF.

Sangiovese- overnight performance seems to have no correlation to aging ability, as almost all fall apart overnight (yet we know lots of Sangiovese wines age well). A well structured Fontodi was horrible on day 2 Saturday. I can think of one Pergole Torte where I found a Sangiovese good on day 2.

This is of course a set of gross generalizations. Would love to hear disagreements.

But you're absolutely right that by modern standards, a 750 is way more than two people can responsibly share, and although I've gotten used to pouring out the leftovers at the end of the evening, it still seems like a small waste.

I'll disagree with this. While we don't usually go through an entire bottle at home in evening, sometimes we do. I'd say typically that would be me having 16-17 ounces (a bit over 3 standard drinks) glasses, Betsy having 8 ounces. As we would tend to do that over a leisurely meal and after, it is spread over 2-3 hours. That scarcely seems irresponsible to me (especially since we aren't driving).

As to pouring out, make vinegar!

[Robin Garr]

I'll disagree with this. While we don't usually go through an entire bottle at home in evening, sometimes we do. I'd say typically that would be me having 16-17 ounces (a bit over 3 standard drinks) glasses, Betsy having 8 ounces. As we would tend to do that over a leisurely meal and after, it is spread over 2-3 hours. That scarcely seems irresponsible to me (especially since we aren't driving).

I sure hope I didn't come across preachy or puritanical, Dale ... didn't mean to present my data as recommendations for others. We generally do short pours of 1 1/2 or 2 ounces - I'm not sure why, it's just a practice we've developed - and may refill that several times over the course of an evening, but it generally works out to maybe 5 of 6 ounces for Mary over the course of an evening and 10 or 12 for me. Either way, that works out in the range of 2/3 of a 750 ml bottle, which feels about right.

[David M. Bueker]

Personally I would rather stick to 8-10 ounces on a weeknight, which isn't even a half bottle. I do find that almost any young wine can stand a night in the fridge, and many high acid whites can take 2, but the reds just never seem to survive well to the third night.

And of course this precludes many of my rapidly aging wines from being opened at all.

Robin,
didn't seem preachy, but just wanted to point out that " way more than two people can responsibly share" is maybe a bit OTT. As I noted, 2/3 is about what we do most nights. But I don't feel irresponsible on a night when I open a fully mature bottle and we finish it. It probably helps that I'm a big person, of course.

Wow, a lot to chew on here. We generally split a 750 and finish it, so I don't have that much experience with the leftovers. I have had a pretty good run with reds, including a $10 Chianti (2005 Castello di Farnetella Chianti Colli Senesi) which was terrific on day one and held just fine for day two. The test ran out at that point. I nursed a 2005 Breton Perrieres for three days (a personal record), and it was still going strong. Generally though, I find whites hold up much better in the fridge than reds. I seem to be the only person in the world who has found wines hold up better closer to the source -- I don't know if European fridges are colder or what, but I've found leftovers seem fresher there. Maybe it's jut that I like being in Europe better.

Dale mentioned Radikon, which I love. My only gripe is that when they moved from 750's to 500's the price remained the same or even went up a little. That felt like a big jump all at once. But the wine, well, it's good.

[Robin Garr]

just wanted to point out that " way more than two people can responsibly share" is maybe a bit OTT. As I noted, 2/3 is about what we do most nights. But I don't feel irresponsible on a night when I open a fully mature bottle and we finish it. It probably helps that I'm a big person, of course.

Yeah, upon re-reading, I could have worded it a lot better than that. Certainly Mary and I will finish a full bottle on occasion, and when we do, this "Thunderbird test" criterion generally signals that we really liked the wine.

.... I generally check on the wine on Day 2 and Day 3 (after that red goes to vinegar crock, white to drain if not used for cooking). I don't think that how a bottle holds up to oxygen is a direct link to aging potential, but I do think it provides a (shaky) data point to some wines.....

Sangiovese- overnight performance seems to have no correlation to aging ability, as almost all fall apart overnight (yet we know lots of Sangiovese wines age well). A well structured Fontodi was horrible on day 2 Saturday. I can think of one Pergole Torte where I found a Sangiovese good on day 2.

At your invitation, Dale, I'll disagree on a couple points, just based on my experience. I use Vacu-vin--a little controversial in these parts, I know--and refrigerate the pumped-and-stoppered half-empty bottles. (I'm not a pessimist, but they're being drained, not filled.) In many cases, it seems to me that whites can hold for up to 3 or 4 days, and reds perhaps a day or two longer. This applies primarily to the 80% percent of wines my wife and I drink that are young (and relatively inexpensive) and usually poured without decanting. I'm guessing their youth gives them more "breathing room." We'll most often finish older bottles in a single evening, although we're somewhat more likely to be sharing them with friends.

It's not my experience that Sangiovese-based wines "fall apart" overnight. Young ones, like most young reds, seem to improve on Day 2. But I tend not to let them sit for more than a couple of nights, as I might for a bigger red. FWIW, if you subbed Zinfandel for Sangio in that paragraph, I'd be likely to agree.

......In many cases, it seems to me that whites can hold for up to 3 or 4 days, and reds perhaps a day or two longer. ........

I'm surprised to hear that reds survive longer for you than whites. My experience has consistently been the reverse. I suppose it could be the wines we're drinking. For white, I tend to gravitate towards Riesling, Muscadet, Chenin, and their cousins.

Clifford, you irresponsible slut!


I should say that in these cases I wasn't making a special effort to save the wines. Our fridge is generally full, so often reds sit out on counter. If a wine is something I really want to save, I generally rebottle in smaller format and chill. On the counter, never has a Sangiovese survived, but Nebbiolo almost always does.
If both refrigerated, I'd still give whites edge over reds. But that is probably because I drink mostly high acid whites.
I had a VacUVin, but was not personally happy enough with results to keep.

Clifford, you irresponsible slut!

Living in an apt. that's usually pretty warm rules out leaving things on the counter. Interesting that Nebbiolo does relatively well; it does make intuitive sense to me, with the acid and the tannin....

[David M. Bueker]

My experiences have been that white wines are always the more likely ones to hold up well. I still don't generally like the results though.

Freeze em.

I froze Angeli's Rose d'un Jour for a few weeks a while ago and later served it to a bunch of wine geeks who all pretty much enjoyed it.

375ml; 500ml. If these were the formats wine came in, I'd just have to use my wine tool more often. On a real good night, I get to open a third, forth, or fifth bottle (750ml). But at least a couple bottles.

I was asked a question some time ago: What do you do with the rest of the bottle? My answer: Finish it.

In fact, sometimes I believe 1L would be the right size. with some wines, it takes just a bit more than a 750ml to watch it evolve. 375ml? Divided by two people? To even enjoy this wine, you better either know exactly when this wine is at its peak, or it better be an everyday drinker that rocks. I really don't know any other way to look at this.

The term "irresponsible" came up earlier. Even though it was retracted (I think), The idea of "irresponsible" is interesting. This is a wine forum, not an orange juice forum. Most of us got into the whole wine game because of the alcohol. We just realized there was something refined and different with wine. Not only are there 1000s of wines, but every year they are different. Hot damn for us! The alcohol is a perk; We can enjoy ourselves.

Just another view......

mark

[David M. Bueker]

Between alcoholic effect and caloric content I have little interest in finishing a 750 ml bottle by myself on a regular basis. I do need to get up in the morning and go to work.

I'm surprised to hear that reds survive longer for you than whites. My experience has consistently been the reverse. I suppose it could be the wines we're drinking. For white, I tend to gravitate towards Riesling, Muscadet, Chenin, and their cousins.

Cliff--
You and David B. make similar points, and I think you're probably right about us drinking different whites most of the time. I'm more of an SB and Italian white kind of person. But though I don't drink a lot of Riesling, I'd certainly agree based on my experience that Muscadet and Chenin hold up especially well.

I love half bottles living alone. Bassin's in DC usually has a good selection but I don't get there more than two or three times a year. On holding up overnight, contrary to Dale's experience with Sangiovese, I often prefer Chianti the second night. It seems a little more mellow but maybe it becomes too mellow for his tastes.

Getting back to David Bueker's original post, coincidentally I was reorganizing some of my wine collection last night and came across two older (for me) Scheurebe Auslese wines and wondered if they might still be viable. One is a 1997 Darting Ungersteiner Honigsackel Scheurebe Auslese and the other is a 2001 Lingenfelder Scheurebe Auslese, both from the Pfalz. David mentioned that he might be visiting North Carolina this fall, so maybe he can render a verdict on them in person. What do you think, David? Have I held them too long? Also, what about the drinking window for Joh. Jos. Christoffel-Erben Urziger Wurzgarten Spatlese from 2002? Would it be closed down now? If so, when do you think it might emerge? I found three bottles of that one.

Clinton,

That makes sense.

JC,

I'm not David but... I don't see any reason to hold any longer. You never know, they could be good. I had a 1998 Muller-Catoir Scheurebe Auslese last year that was still doing fine, though it might well have been better a few years ago.

Cheers,
Cliff

[David M. Bueker]

JC,

Those Scheurebes will likely be fine if not in tip-top form. I'll let you know when I get to NC again (sooner than fall I think).

As for the Christoffel 2002, I would hold for now. I am popping a huge number of 2001s this weekend, including some Christoffel. I expect the 2002 to be a bit behind in evolution, so I'll report & we can infer.

Okay, thanks for the replies.