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WTN: Madirans

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WTN: Madirans

by Saina » Tue Feb 05, 2008 7:15 pm

Tonight we had a tasting of Madirans, mostly big names. We started with a couple dry whites:

  • 1999 Château Bouscassé Pacherenc du Vic-Bilh - France, Southwest France, Pacherenc du Vic-Bilh (2/5/2008)
    A strong scent of pineapples, pears and minerals. Full bodied, fat even, but with some nice citrussiness. An almost Rhone-white-like weightiness and oilyness. Nice!
  • 2001 Château Montus Pacherenc du Vic-Bilh Sec - France, Southwest France, Pacherenc du Vic-Bilh Sec (2/5/2008)
    This smells very anonymous/international - the Barrique treatment has destroyed any sense of grape or place. Limpid fruit, toffee, lots of oak, some citrussy acidity to keep it refreshing. Not flawed, but for me not interesting either.

Then we continued with, mainly, a theme of 2000 reds:
  • 2000 Château Montus Madiran - France, Southwest France, Madiran (2/5/2008)
    Very oaky, meaty, dark fruit. The oak nearly manages to mask the Madiran-aromas underneath. The palate isn't so overoaked: vibrant, dark, masculine, brutishly tannic, wild. I like parts of it, but really would require less oak to be able to enjoy it thorougly.
  • 2000 Château d'Aydie Madiran Odé d'Aydie - France, Southwest France, Madiran (2/5/2008)
    This is meaty and red toned and also has the blue floral notes of the basic Madiran, but this sadly shows sings of Barrique on the nose. The palate is fairly low in acid, not as vibrant as the basic Madiran, but with much ripe tannin and some attractive red fruit - again it is a more feminine style of Madiran. Sadly the aftertaste is both oaky and abrupt.
  • 2000 Château d'Aydie Madiran - France, Southwest France, Madiran (2/5/2008)
    An earthy and meaty nose, with lots of blue flowers and red berries, elegantly animal. Lively, vibrant, red toned but tannic. This seems very natural and perfectly delineated, though it is perhaps a "feminine" style for Madiran. A lovely wine.
  • 2000 Château Bouscassé Madiran Vieilles Vignes - France, Southwest France, Madiran (2/5/2008)
    The oak is overwhelming. Very strange for Bouscassé VV. Undrinkable, modern, anonymous - very different from the early-mid-'90's VVs I've had recently.
  • 2000 Château Montus Madiran Cuvée Prestige - France, Southwest France, Madiran (2/5/2008)
    Blueberry oak, tarry like a Barossa Shiraz(!), yet with a wild meatiness and a very attractive cigar aroma underneath the oak and over-ripe black fruit. Flabby/almost acidless, yet very tannic, lifeless fruit, too oaky. One of the weirdest and un-Madiranny Madirans I've ever tasted. I'm not convinced.
  • 2000 Château Montus Madiran La Tyre - France, Southwest France, Madiran (2/5/2008)
    This was made in an international/anonymous style, yet it is very, very well made if one doesn't mind a modern bent: much fruit of great, dark depth, unnaturally soft (yet copious) tannins for Madiran, fairly low in acidity yet still lively. It may not be my preferred style (too much oak), yet here I can see what the fuss is about.
  • 1998 Château Bouscassé Madiran Vieilles Vignes - France, Southwest France, Madiran (2/5/2008)
    Meaty, some red tones to the dark fruit, animal, herbal, leafy - quite a wonderful nose! The palate is a bit disappointing: slightly sweet red fruit, short in length and in structure. Compared to another recent bottle this was disappointing on the palate, yet I couldn't find any outright flaws.
  • 1998 Château Bouscassé Madiran Cuvée Alban Brumont - France, Southwest France, Madiran (2/5/2008)
    This is apparently a one-off cuvée in memory of Alban. A beautiful nose of sous-bois, leafyness, vibrant red fruit, meaty and floral. The oak seems to have integrated fully. Elegant for a Madiran, but still with a great tannic structure and lively acidity and enough fruit to promise an elegant future. Lovely.
  • 1996 Michel Carrier / Domaine du Miralie Madiran - France, Southwest France, Madiran (2/5/2008)
    There is some nice red, lingonberry-like fruit and earthiness, yet an unattractive scent of rhubarb also. The palate is too much like a tart, sugarless juice to be much fun. I'll pass.

We finished with a few sweets:
  • 2002 Château Barréjat Pacherenc du Vic-Bilh - France, Southwest France, Pacherenc du Vic-Bilh (2/5/2008)
    A very pure and refreshing nose of wet rock and crystallised fruit. Vibrant, moderately sweet, citrussy acidity, refreshing - light yet moderately intense. A very charming dessert. I like it very much - especially for the 10€ or so that it costs!
  • 1999 Alain Brumont Pacherenc du Vic-Bilh Octobre - France, Southwest France, Pacherenc du Vic-Bilh (2/5/2008)
    Oaky, some refreshing aromas, elegant botrytis. Sweet, moderately light for a dessert wine, yet oaky. Competently made, but not really to my taste.
  • 2000 Alain Brumont Madiran Doux Brumaire Novembre Pacherenc-du-vic-bilh - France, Southwest France, Madiran (2/5/2008)
    Very oaky, botrytised nose - smells like an oaky, heavy styled Sauternes (à la Rieussec). Intense, heavy palate, oaky, creamy. Probably very good, but a bit too much for me.
  • 2000 Château d'Aydie Pacherenc du Vic-Bilh - France, Southwest France, Pacherenc du Vic-Bilh (2/5/2008)
    A very interesting wine as its spends 10-12 months in acacia barrels. It is oxidative and appley, not too woody, sweet and refreshing. I like it!
  • 2000 Château d'Aydie Vin de Liqueur Maydie - France, Southwest France (2/5/2008)
    Dark, inky, brooding, herbal and medicinal - almost like a Barolo Chinato! Sweet and tangy, wild and dark. Quite wonderful in a freakish way!
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Re: WTN: Madirans

by Bill Hooper » Tue Feb 05, 2008 7:43 pm

Interesting notes Otto. While I'm not so versed in Madiran, it seems like Montus, D'Aydie, and Boucasse are the names to beat down there. I've heard that lately, many of the producers were diving deep into micro-oxygenation which (somebody correct me) I think was invented by the Laplace family of Chateau D'Aydie to 'deal' with the Tannat grape and her tannins. Personally, I've noticed a huge stylistic departure from the 'old-way' in the late vintage Madirans I've tried recently and while I'm not a fan of too much new wood on anything, I would hope that the overwhelming oakiness you encountered would fade after a few years.

Thanks for the notes!
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Re: WTN: Madirans

by Saina » Wed Feb 06, 2008 2:13 pm

Bill Hooper wrote:I've heard that lately, many of the producers were diving deep into micro-oxygenation which (somebody correct me) I think was invented by the Laplace family of Chateau D'Aydie to 'deal' with the Tannat grape and her tannins.


I didn't know it was the chaps at d'Aydie who invented the micro-ox, but apparently they know how to do it well, since the non-cuvée-named Madiran was a very natural, unforced seeming wine. So, spoofulation isn't always bad! :)

Personally, I've noticed a huge stylistic departure from the 'old-way' in the late vintage Madirans I've tried recently and while I'm not a fan of too much new wood on anything, I would hope that the overwhelming oakiness you encountered would fade after a few years.


I hope so too. I have drunk huge amounts of the basic Bouscassé 1999 and love it. And I have drunk a fair bit of 1991-1998 Bouscassé VV. And I think compared to the '00 VV there was a huge difference in style - something that I cannot imagine two years of aging would change to the style I recognised from before.
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Re: WTN: Madirans

by Bob Parsons Alberta » Thu Feb 07, 2008 3:02 am

All those P du Vic-Bilh, must have been a trade tasting? One of my fave whites from the south, when I can find them!!
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Re: WTN: Madirans

by Tim York » Thu Feb 07, 2008 1:34 pm

Bill Hooper wrote: I've heard that lately, many of the producers were diving deep into micro-oxygenation which (somebody correct me) I think was invented by the Laplace family of Chateau D'Aydie to 'deal' with the Tannat grape and her tannins. Personally, I've noticed a huge stylistic departure from the 'old-way' in the late vintage Madirans I've tried recently and while I'm not a fan of too much new wood on anything, I would hope that the overwhelming oakiness you encountered would fade after a few years.

Thanks for the notes!


According to my reference books, micro-oxygenation was invented by Patrick Ducournau of Chapelle-Lenclos/Domaine Mouréou in Madiran.

I agree that it is a pity that so many of the Madiran producers have been bitten by the new oak bug. Bouscassé used to be less infected than Montus, so Otto's note about the 2000 is worrying. However I did not note this as a problem on the Bouscassé 2002s which I tasted last autumn but I think that I am less quercophobic than Otto.
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Re: WTN: Madirans

by Bill Hooper » Thu Feb 07, 2008 2:47 pm

Tim York wrote:micro-oxygenation which (somebody correct me) I think was invented by the Laplace family of Chateau D'Aydie to 'deal' with the Tannat grape and her tannins.


According to my reference books, micro-oxygenation was invented by Patrick Ducournau of Chapelle-Lenclos/Domaine Mouréou in Madiran.[/quote]

Thanks for the info Tim.
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Re: WTN: Madirans

by Saina » Thu Feb 07, 2008 3:34 pm

Bob Parsons Alberta. wrote:All those P du Vic-Bilh, must have been a trade tasting? One of my fave whites from the south, when I can find them!!


Not a trade tasting, but something I actually paid for! :) PdV-B is very interesting and I would really love to taste more of it.

Tim, I've drunk huge amounts of the basic Bouscassé 1999 and at least that hasn't been infected by the new oak bug. I hear that the basic should still be in a "traditional" style.

-O
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Re: WTN: Madirans

by Lou Kessler » Thu Feb 07, 2008 9:53 pm

Have a few bottles of 95 Montus Prestige Madiran in my cellar. Anyone have any knowledge? Thanks in advance. :?:
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Re: WTN: Madirans

by Saina » Fri Feb 08, 2008 4:31 pm

Lou Kessler wrote:Have a few bottles of 95 Montus Prestige Madiran in my cellar. Anyone have any knowledge? Thanks in advance. :?:


I haven't had it for a while, but I expect it would still be very young. Like I have written here before, I have usually preferred Bouscassé because they aren't (this tasting's 2000 excepted) as oaky as Montus. I would guess the oak is integrating somewhat, so if you tolerate it more than I do, I think you will enjoy it. But it is still burly and masculine and dark - if you open it, I would love to hear your views on it.

-O
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