Grateful for the new forum? "Pay it forward"!

[Robin Garr]

I know we're all immensely grateful to our lovably shy, almost-anonymous ForumAdmin for his usual great work in overseeing the forum upgrade and making it happen with amazingly little trauma.

As usual, ForumAdmin has asked nothing in return for his hard work. But if you're grateful enough to be willing to pitch a little something into the tip jar, we'd like to propose a way to thank him in a meaningful way by "paying it forward:" donating small gift certificates that he can use to make economic development loans to entrepreneurs in emerging countries through the outstanding organization Kiva.org.

Kiva gift certificates are issued in $25 denominations. They are not tax-deductible, but they go toward a very good cause: Browse http://www.kiva.org and I hope you'll be as inspired as quite a few of us have been. Kiva is a venture worth supporting in its own right, but by making a donation in this specific form, you'll both make a strong gesture of thanks to ForumAdmin AND a concrete contribution to help people all over the world lift themselves up by their own bootstraps.

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KIVA. org instructions
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Click to the Kiva.org Gift Certificate page:
http://www.kiva.org/app.php?page=gift&a ... tPromotion

Fill in the form exactly as follows:

Recipient's first name: Wine Lovers
Recipient's last name: Discussion Group
Recipient's email address: kiva@talkathon.org
Confirm email address: kiva@talkathon.org

LEAVE CHECKED: "Email this to the recipient immediately after purchase:"

"Enter a personal message (250 characters max):"
(Use this space to say something nice to ForumAdmin)

Kiva.org will ask you to register to complete the process. Don't worry. They will not spam you. And you may just find that you want to go on and make a few more loans to specific projects that capture your imagination.

You'll be offered the option to pay by Paypal. Note that Paypal takes NO COMMISSION on credit-card transactions for Kiva.org.

Excellent, Robin. Kiva is a great organization and a great cause.

Great idea, Robin. Thank you and thanks to Forum Admin.

Done! Thanks for the suggestion.

I agree that this is a fantastic way to thank ForumAdmin for all the hard work on the new home for WLDG.

FA and I discovered Kiva around the same time very early last year, and are complete addicts. We've even arranged to meet online to pick one person to both loan to, which was unbelievably fun!

Kiva Rocks! ForumAdmin Rocks! It's a no-brainer.

[Robin Garr]

I agree that this is a fantastic way to thank ForumAdmin for all the hard work on the new home for WLDG.

FA and I discovered Kiva around the same time very early last year, and are complete addicts. We've even arranged to meet online to pick one person to both loan to, which was unbelievably fun!

You know I followed in your footprints as soon as I heard about it. I've been a big supporter of the microlending concept ever since I worked in a related field in the early 1990s, and I think Kiva is a great way to use the Web to bring together thousands of micro-donors and thousands of micro-businesses. I love it! I'm not sure I'm addicted yet, but I rarely go there without finding some program to give a few dollars to.

Kiva Rocks! ForumAdmin Rocks! It's a no-brainer.

I hope everyone who's enjoying the new forum and/or feels grateful for the major effort that went into building this version will take a few moments to invest a few dollars. I hope it's clear that *nobody* is pocketing a tithe for this. *All* the money goes to the Kiva recipients. As I understand it, even PayPal gives up its share as a way to support the program.

Robin, one small clarification: all payments apparently are made through PayPal. I tried to use a credit card directly, but the card charged PayPal which actually paid for the gift card and the extra administrative contribution I chose to make.

I only mention the point because some folks, including me, have had trouble with PayPal in the past. My PayPal account was canceled last year. I sent a note to KIVA that I'll get the funds to them another way if the credit card to PayPal to KIVA route doesn't work.

Despite the potential problem with PayPal, this is still a fantastic idea, and I'm delighted you thought of and implemented it.

Regards, Bob

Grateful for the forum, grateful for the hard work maintaining it and improving it, and grateful for the suggestion to pay it forward.
Charles

What happened with Paypal, Bob ? I've always found the system to work well...

Thanks, Celia

It started out as just some Spam, Celia. Fake emails saying that I needed to update my credit card info, personal data, etc. Typical phishing crap at first.

After a hundred or so Messages, I contacted PayPal who gave me the standard cautions that they wouldn't contact me and ask for info, they would look into the emails, etc.

The emails got more and more intense, and in a strange way started to track our travels: a warning that unusual activities had occurred in California, for example, right after we returned from a California trip. Same for New Mexico. Then, same for Russia just after we came home from a cruise through the Baltic.

I rarely used PayPal -- maybe a half dozen times -- but it was a little troubling since PayPal couldn't stop the flow. We decided it was easiest just to cancel our PayPal account, so that any messages we received were clearly irrelevant. The astonishing thing, really, is that as soon as we canceled the account, we received two more emails and then the emails stopped entirely.

It will be interesting to see what happens now that KIVA's site has passed my credit card info on to PayPal. I'm not at all worried; if the emails start we'll just cancel the PayPal account again. [I may cancel in a couple of weeks just to be sure.]

I'm more worried, frankly, that KIVA won't get the contribution. Regards, Bob

Thanks, Bob. Did you actually use paypal in California or Russia or New Mexico ? If not, I wonder if it's someone who's tapped into your travel agent instead, and just taking a punt on your having a paypal account. I know what you mean, though, I'll get spam email which seems related to something I've looked into recently - for example, I recently received one titled "Crystal", and my hobby is making jewellery, so it was relevant. I don't understand how cookies work well enough, but I sometimes wonder if spammers are lifting email addresses off those. Hmmm....Pete's just said he gets paypal spam, and he doesn't have a paypal account !

No, the last time I used PayPal was almost three years ago. What made it troubling was that we actually had a valid account. I kept checking after each email when we hit the 100 email point, and never found any activity. So it was clearly Spam. But ... who needs any stress from an account that we didn't use?

Most vendors have been willing to accept a check or a credit card, especially if I offer to pay the fees MasterCard or Visa charge them. But sometimes they don't have either account, and are unwilling to accept a check, even up front with no obligation to ship until the check clears.

By the time we get through all the red tape, I've usually convinced myself I don't really need whatever it is I was trying to buy.

I should add that we have at least 150 online transactions a year, maybe more -- Costco has just started offering some of their nicest stuff only online.

Probably for the best, Bob, and I'm glad to hear you never lost any money. It's amazing how much we do over the internet these days as well...I don't know how retail outlets without an internet site manage to keep up these days...

Bob, I'm confused. I don't have a PayPal account and I use a card to pay on Kiva all the time. The option is: Pay with Credit Card or Log In. The payment is only processed through PayPal for Kiva, as it would be by any other merchant services firm. Doing this does not create an account with PayPal.

I get no e-mail or spam from PayPal or PayPal phishers. I've been doing it this way since I joined Kiva in February 2007.

Thanks, Cynthia. I wasn't sure what mechanism PayPal was using, but it appears they are acting as agent for KIVA and not as an agent for me or as a joint agent for both KIVA and me.

If they are solely KIVA's agent, the funds will go through fine, without re-initiating my canceled account. Thanks for the reassurance.

What's not clear to me in this system, though, is who pays the credit card company its commission? Do the credit card company and PayPal have an arrangement that the credit card company won't get a commission. Must be, if the full donation goes to KIVA. I'll have to chalk one up for AmExp.

Thanks for the input. Bob

You are most welcome, s FA -- did you notice the microscopic engraving on the back of the watch?

Just out of curiosity, do you know if the credit card company also waives its fees?

It looks like "Read my lips: GOI" but I don't have my reading glasses.

I recognize the small yet elegant size of the watch makes reading the inscription problematic even with the strongest of glasses.

Bob, I do not know, that's a fair question and you wil have the answer near the end of the month. Let me/us know, please.

I'm not sure that would tell the tale. Even if the charge is net net, someone along the line might have picked up or eaten AmEx's charges. I've asked Rachelle at Kiva if she knows. (The people at Kiva are all wonderfully helpful.)

I'll revert.

You are most welcome, s FA

Let me guess, it stands for "Sweet Forum Admin" ?