Musar's bottle variation - myth or reality?

It seems to be received wisdom and the experience of many that Musar has lots of bottle variation. I love Musar and drink lots of it, yet I haven't experienced any greater bottle variation than with other wines. Sure I've had some instances where some bottles don't show as well as others, but this is normal with cork stopped wines (vive le screwcap!). I would very much like to hear any comments on bottle variation from others who drink Musar - do you find more of it than in other wines? How have your different bottles tasted? Any evidence for or against I would find interesting...

From my experience, reality. I'd say the bottle of '95 that appeared at an offline when Robin and Mary came to NYC didn't really resemble one at a La Grolla offline with Paulo. The Musar I've had the most of was the '93. I had a beautiful bottle, tasted like a very good Rhone. So bought several (same source). Couple were quite lovely (though one seemed more Bordeauxish), but one had over the top VA, and in another the brett was just too much for me.

I don't know much about wine chemistry, so the varying VA of a Musar is a mystery to me. But I do know that wines with significant brett (and I've nevr heard anyone deny Musar is a bretty wine) do tend to have a lot of variation. Chance, temperature, etc mean that brett can explode in one bottle and be less extreme in another (that applies to wines like '90 Montrose, too).

I don't know much about wine chemistry, so the varying VA of a Musar is a mystery to me.

Don't know what their storage capacity is for any one vintage; do they have to split volume into multiple tanks and do they have the capacity to blend barrels into one tank before bottling? And, do they bottle a vintage of a single wine in one pass?

Separate storage and separate bottlings of the same vintage can create variabilities in the bottles.

Also, if their controls aren't in good order, their storage and bottling can be hit or miss--they can luck out on one batch and get caught on another.

It takes exposure to oxygen for VA bacteria to flourish.

[Robin Garr]

How have your different bottles tasted? Any evidence for or against I would find interesting...

Otto, based on a fair amount of Musar tasting at offlines and some at home, my best guess is this: Musar is a wine to be laid down, and storage conditions dramatically influence its character over time. The big problems I've seen don't seem related to VA so much as maderization, and this has varied so unpredictably, even among wines of similar vintage, makes me deeply skeptical about whether any Musar of unknown provenance has been kept under ideal conditions.

Is Musar peculiarly subject to damage from less than perfect cellaring? That I can't say. But I've run into enough Sherrylike, flat and funky red Musars at 10 years out from the vintage and beyond that I have to wonder.

Is Musar peculiarly subject to damage from less than perfect cellaring?

I understand from my visit to the property, that they use the absolute minimum amount of sulphur possible. I guess this would make it a microbiological time bomb if subjected to greater than cellar temperatures?

-O-

a microbiological time bomb if subjected to greater than cellar temperatures?

-O-

What are their cellars like?

Is Musar peculiarly subject to damage from less than perfect cellaring?

I understand from my visit to the property, that they use the absolute minimum amount of sulphur possible. I guess this would make it a microbiological time bomb if subjected to greater than cellar temperatures?

-O-

Plus, if their controls throughout the winemaking, storage and bottling are not up to par, they could introduce problems.

Where they grow grapes in Lebanon is a relatively hot place. If their harvest parameters are problematic, the wines will suffer. Sometimes, grapes in hot places are cooked or oxidized before they are processed, and if the SO2 regimen is ideological rather than targeted to the specific conditions of the crop, oxidation could be built right into the winemaking process.

The result of winemaking has no blanket answers, which is why it is both highly technical and extremely risky.

I used to work for a distributor that carried Musar. I have never trusted the wines and have never spent a dime on them for that reason.

This feels like the equivalent of asking your pals "My girlfriend, she's not all that pretty is she?"

Otto: I really don't worry about the variation (though if I was buying older vintages at £50-£100 a go then I think I would). Musar for me is unique and I'll take it with all the perceived/real faults and variations. Like true love, we see past the faults.

p.s. Recently shared a bottle of the '99 Musar with the visiting 'outlaws' (Cask wine afficionados) and as so often with Musar, they were impressed (more so than some more expensive bottles we opened). If there was one wine I'd stick in a tasting for newbies, it would be Musar, as it's so often a 'love at first sight' wine.

regards

Ian

[David M. Bueker]

I've had Musar red four times & every single time it was cooked to within an inch of its life.

What are their cellars like?

Underground, cool, dampish and ideal. I don't think poor storage at the site itself can be blamed. This is what they look like.

Thomas, the style is deliberately a little bit oxidative. So it seems that transport from Lebanon might be an issue? If so, I must consider myself lucky that I've had no major problems...

-O-

What are their cellars like?

Underground, cool, dampish and ideal. I don't think poor storage at the site itself can be blamed. This is what they look like.

Thomas, the style is deliberately a little bit oxidative. So it seems that transport from Lebanon might be an issue? If so, I must consider myself lucky that I've had no major problems...

-O-

Otto,

I don't mean bottle storage, I mean tank and barrel storage.

If the wines are purposely oxidized, and the SO2 is purposely kept at a minimum, then the producer has an added burden of making sure the aceto bacteria doesn't get at it.

I'm afraid in many cases, Musar loses that battle, at least that's been my experience with the wine.