The place for all things wine, focused on serious wine discussions.

Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal?

Moderators: Jenise, Robin Garr, David M. Bueker

no avatar
User

Jay Miller

Rank

Ultra geek

Posts

228

Joined

Wed Mar 22, 2006 10:02 pm

Re: Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal

by Jay Miller » Tue Mar 28, 2006 11:24 am

Bill Hooper wrote:
Jay Miller wrote:Wait, they grow Malbec outside the Touraine? Everyone knows that the best Cot/Malbec is made by Clos Roche Blanche. A 1998 last night was just... just... I'm sorry, I can't go on... so beautiful...


I had the 2001 a few weeks ago -fantastic! How's their Cabernet Sauvignon?

-Bill


They don't make a Cabernet Sauvignon, but their Cabernet Franc (presumably what you're talking about as it says Cabernet on the label) is also fantastic. The Cot (from very old vines) really needs 10 years or so in a good vintage to start showing what it's got. In a lighter vintage like '98 (or '01) it seems that 8 years is enough to start to give glimpses of its greatness as the '98 was very young but just kept getting better and better as the night progressed. I'll open my first '02 (a great year) in 2012 but probably save the rest for 2017.
no avatar
User

Manuel Camblor

Rank

Ultra geek

Posts

265

Joined

Thu Mar 23, 2006 11:23 am

Location

New York, NY

Re: Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal

by Manuel Camblor » Tue Mar 28, 2006 11:57 am

On the subject of CRB Côt, let's not forget teh 2003, one of the few wines I like from anywhere in Europe in that infernally hot vintage. Recent bottles have shown quite nicely. It's not a vin de garde in the way that most of its older brethren are, or even in the way of the '98 or '01. I htink I would drink it now...
Best,

LL
no avatar
User

Manuel Camblor

Rank

Ultra geek

Posts

265

Joined

Thu Mar 23, 2006 11:23 am

Location

New York, NY

Re: Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal

by Manuel Camblor » Tue Mar 28, 2006 12:39 pm

SO wait a second... Here one goes from "Newbie" (or whatever it is) to "Cellar Rat around post #10. Then, since I've seen my own designation change, one goes from "Cellar Rat" to "Wine Geek" around post #30?

This is confusing. Iwould have expected that coming away from "Newbie"-ness would have required at least 500 posts. Besides, Jay is waaaaaaaayyyyyyyyy geekier than I am... :D
Best,

LL
no avatar
User

Robin Garr

Rank

Forum Janitor

Posts

21845

Joined

Fri Feb 17, 2006 1:44 pm

Location

Louisville, KY

Re: Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal

by Robin Garr » Tue Mar 28, 2006 12:49 pm

Manuel Camblor wrote:This is confusing. Iwould have expected that coming away from "Newbie"-ness would have required at least 500 posts.


You may be confusing us with Another Forum. Here we embrace newbies ... and assimilate them.

Besides, Jay is waaaaaaaayyyyyyyyy geekier than I am... :D


Well, that, too.
no avatar
User

Bill Spohn

Rank

He put the 'bar' in 'barrister'

Posts

10497

Joined

Tue Mar 21, 2006 7:31 pm

Location

Vancouver BC

Re: Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal

by Bill Spohn » Tue Mar 28, 2006 1:04 pm

Robin Garr wrote:You may be confusing us with Another Forum. Here we embrace newbies ... and assimilate them.


Embrace them and stimulate them?

Didn't know it was THAT sort of forum.....
no avatar
User

Robin Garr

Rank

Forum Janitor

Posts

21845

Joined

Fri Feb 17, 2006 1:44 pm

Location

Louisville, KY

Re: Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal

by Robin Garr » Tue Mar 28, 2006 1:20 pm

Bill Spohn wrote:Didn't know it was THAT sort of forum.....


Never really thought about the significance of "adult beverages," did ya? ;-)
no avatar
User

Manuel Camblor

Rank

Ultra geek

Posts

265

Joined

Thu Mar 23, 2006 11:23 am

Location

New York, NY

Re: Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal

by Manuel Camblor » Tue Mar 28, 2006 2:09 pm

Robin Garr wrote:
Manuel Camblor wrote:This is confusing. Iwould have expected that coming away from "Newbie"-ness would have required at least 500 posts.


You may be confusing us with Another Forum. Here we embrace newbies ... and assimilate them.

Besides, Jay is waaaaaaaayyyyyyyyy geekier than I am... :D


Well, that, too.


So hold on a second... If I get to 300-something posts, will "Board Janitor" appear under my name, too? When does "Senior Executive Oenophile" kick in?
Best,

LL
no avatar
User

Robin Garr

Rank

Forum Janitor

Posts

21845

Joined

Fri Feb 17, 2006 1:44 pm

Location

Louisville, KY

Re: Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal

by Robin Garr » Tue Mar 28, 2006 2:34 pm

Manuel Camblor wrote:If I get to 300-something posts, will "Board Janitor" appear under my name, too?


Newp! That one is reserved for me. :) Post on, though. You never know what might happen at any random message point.

When does "Senior Executive Oenophile" kick in?


On this forum, never. No suits, no ties, no shepherds and no sheep around here.
no avatar
User

Paul B.

Rank

Hybrid Guru

Posts

2063

Joined

Wed Mar 22, 2006 11:38 pm

Location

Ontario, Canada

Re: Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal

by Paul B. » Tue Mar 28, 2006 3:02 pm

Robin Garr wrote:No suits, no ties, no shepherds and no sheep around here.

Who was it who once said something to the effect of, "never trust anyone in a suit"? :D

It's good to have the real WLDG resurrected.
http://hybridwines.blogspot.ca
no avatar
User

Manuel Camblor

Rank

Ultra geek

Posts

265

Joined

Thu Mar 23, 2006 11:23 am

Location

New York, NY

Re: Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal

by Manuel Camblor » Tue Mar 28, 2006 3:25 pm

Robin Garr wrote:
Manuel Camblor wrote:
When does "Senior Executive Oenophile" kick in?


On this forum, never. No suits, no ties, no shepherds and no sheep around here.


Hey, I sometimes wear suits. Nice ones, too.
Best,

LL
no avatar
User

Robin Garr

Rank

Forum Janitor

Posts

21845

Joined

Fri Feb 17, 2006 1:44 pm

Location

Louisville, KY

Re: Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal

by Robin Garr » Tue Mar 28, 2006 3:31 pm

Manuel Camblor wrote:Hey, I sometimes wear suits. Nice ones, too.


Oh, I do too, but don't spoil my rant please ...
no avatar
User

Sue Courtney

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

1809

Joined

Wed Mar 22, 2006 6:33 pm

Location

Auckland, NZ

Re: Malbec

by Sue Courtney » Tue Mar 28, 2006 4:23 pm

Manuel Camblor wrote:
Bill Spohn wrote:
pjborras wrote:Also there is another grape in Uruguay call Tanant. Have anybody tried it?

Yes indeed, though not as much as I'd like to.

So far it has been unrelenting crap. Best one I tasted was Pisano Arietxea and it didn't rise above the mundane. The others were nearly undrinkable.

The boys in the Madiran don't have to start worrying yet.


Last Pisano Tannat I had was at the MoCool with the "Below the Belt" theme (what was that, '98?). I brought it to the picnic. Can't remember what I may have thought about it. Not much avail;ability in NYC, as far as the hsops I frequent go. But then again, not that much Madiran, either...

I tried a Tannat once and boy, was it tannic! It was from Argentina, not Uruguay.
There is at least one vineyard of Tannat here in New Zealand although I don't think any wine has been made from it yet. Maybe this vintage. It's being grown by a chap called Ross Spence on a small vineyard near his house. Ross has always be an experimenter and when he started Matua Valley wines, he made NZ's first commercial sauvignon blanc. Of course Matua Valley is part of the Fosters stable now.
no avatar
User

Jay Miller

Rank

Ultra geek

Posts

228

Joined

Wed Mar 22, 2006 10:02 pm

Re: Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal

by Jay Miller » Tue Mar 28, 2006 8:45 pm

Manuel Camblor wrote:On the subject of CRB Côt, let's not forget teh 2003, one of the few wines I like from anywhere in Europe in that infernally hot vintage. Recent bottles have shown quite nicely. It's not a vin de garde in the way that most of its older brethren are, or even in the way of the '98 or '01. I htink I would drink it now...


Yeah, I agree that the '03s are for nearer term drinking. The Cabernet is also quite good in '03 but I didn't really like the Sauvignon Blanc or the Gamay. BTW, the '98 CRB Sauvignon Blanc 'Cuvee Buster' was magnificent on Sunday as well. Bless Andrew for putting these wines away.
no avatar
User

Manuel Camblor

Rank

Ultra geek

Posts

265

Joined

Thu Mar 23, 2006 11:23 am

Location

New York, NY

Re: Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal

by Manuel Camblor » Tue Mar 28, 2006 10:45 pm

Jay Miller wrote: BTW, the '98 CRB Sauvignon Blanc 'Cuvee Buster' was magnificent on Sunday as well. Bless Andrew for putting these wines away.


Yeah, sure, rub it in... I'm kicking myself even more now that I know that Josie's plans for the weekend invlved painting the damn apartment... I could have used some Bustering.
Best,

LL
no avatar
User

fjlosada

Rank

Wine geek

Posts

39

Joined

Sun Mar 26, 2006 11:33 pm

Location

New York

Re: Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal

by fjlosada » Tue Mar 28, 2006 11:35 pm

Let's see. You were the one making suggestions about those who "buy into the points and the hype". You call me clumsy and unintelligent. But I'm the insolent one. Strange.
There was nothing facetious about your original post. What you wrote was clear, as was my answer. No wrong interpretation. You also said "Now, paying $70 or more for the top new release of Achaval-Ferrer? There I would protest. Just doesn't give me anything I couldn't find for $25 in other regions." And then "You recommended the bodega and I dutifully went and bought a bottle of something by them from Astor Wines for, if I can remember correctly, about $30. I don't think it was that "inca Altamira", though, since what sticks in my mind is a more fanciful name." So you never had the wine but you give your opinion about it. Curious. Was that facetious too?
Really, back to wine. This thread has left me with a sour aftertaste.
no avatar
User

Manuel Camblor

Rank

Ultra geek

Posts

265

Joined

Thu Mar 23, 2006 11:23 am

Location

New York, NY

Re: Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal

by Manuel Camblor » Wed Mar 29, 2006 12:11 am

fjlosada wrote:Let's see. You were the one making suggestions about those who "buy into the points and the hype". You call me clumsy and unintelligent. But I'm the insolent one. Strange.
There was nothing facetious about your original post. What you wrote was clear, as was my answer. No wrong interpretation. You also said "Now, paying $70 or more for the top new release of Achaval-Ferrer? There I would protest. Just doesn't give me anything I couldn't find for $25 in other regions." And then "You recommended the bodega and I dutifully went and bought a bottle of something by them from Astor Wines for, if I can remember correctly, about $30. I don't think it was that "inca Altamira", though, since what sticks in my mind is a more fanciful name." So you never had the wine but you give your opinion about it. Curious. Was that facetious too?
Really, back to wine. This thread has left me with a sour aftertaste.


Fernando,

I believe you are a smart man. Which is why these strange attempts to twist my words around and constantly pointing to things that simply aren;t there are quite puzzling to me.

Of course I object to paying $70 or more for the latest top release by Achaval Ferrer. Having tried their "second" wine and found it wanting, I don't feel I want to invest the kind of money they ask for the top stuff. I haven't said I've tasted that Finca Altamira. If I have made a statemnt on this board to that effect, I'd be thankful if you quoted it, especially if it involves a tasting note of the wine. The opinion I stated was one that I thought would be easy to grasp: Given what they do at the $30 level, I feel little inclination to go spending $70 on another of their products. Or, to put it another way, I have other things in which to spend 70 bucks. If it's Argentine Malbec, it better be going for much less if it wants my attention.

You want me to try the stuff? You buy it and pour it. I'll bring some good Burgundy, just in case.

And please get it out of your head: The Anti-Argentinian-Malbec Mafia isn't paying me. I am not equivocating or falsifying anything. If I forget exactly what I said a year ago, well, hell, getting old's a bitch. But I make every effort to be consistent. Ask around. People will corroborate this. There is simply a style of wine that I do not like. That style, taken to extremes, I find offensive. Do I not have a right to feel this way? Is there some sort of "objective standard" that dictates these wines are great and worth whatever money is being asked for them? If so, forgive me, I didn't get that memo.

But anyway, my mother always told me that if I didn't like somebody's tone when they were addressing me, it was highly probable that the discussion would not be worth pursuing. You seem to bring everything to a personal level with which I am not comfortable. So let's just drop this one, okay?
Best,

LL
no avatar
User

Bob Parsons Alberta

Rank

aka Doris

Posts

10860

Joined

Tue Mar 21, 2006 3:09 pm

Re: Uh-huh...

by Bob Parsons Alberta » Sun Jan 28, 2007 10:16 pm

Manuel Camblor wrote:Figured out the 64 X 64 thing already. Will resize the image in Photoshop and there will be no more problem soon...

I tried an Altos Las Hormigas not so long ago, as part of my "My Vote fo Values" series (not to be confused with Coad's "Boatloads of Cheap Crap") and found the wine to be pretty dismal. I was at a store the other day that carried one that bears the name of Michel Rolland on the label, called "Clos de los Siete". It was about $15, I think. I almost bought it, to see if it bore any resemblance to all those former-clarets Mr. Rolland has been so kind to mess up for me in the past decade.

But then I thought better of it...


Manuel, I have the `05 Altos las Hormigas open so here goes!! I will post TN on the Open Mike Malbec.
It was time to resurrect this thread. LOL.
no avatar
User

James Roscoe

Rank

Chat Prince

Posts

11057

Joined

Wed Mar 22, 2006 6:43 pm

Location

D.C. Metro Area - Maryland

Re: The resurection

by James Roscoe » Sun Jan 28, 2007 10:26 pm

Bob, you are one sick dude. Is it really that cold up on the ranch? What the heck, maybe this proves there really is a life after death. :roll:
Yes, and how many deaths will it take 'til he knows
That too many people have died?
The answer, my friend, is blowin' in the wind
The answer is blowin' in the wind.
no avatar
User

Manuel Camblor

Rank

Ultra geek

Posts

265

Joined

Thu Mar 23, 2006 11:23 am

Location

New York, NY

Re: The resurection

by Manuel Camblor » Sun Jan 28, 2007 10:53 pm

So, threadsurreciton runs rampant here, too?
Best,

LL
no avatar
User

Dave Erickson

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

808

Joined

Tue Jun 20, 2006 4:31 pm

Location

Asheville, NC

Re: Malbec - Interesting complex variety or one-dimensionsal

by Dave Erickson » Mon Jan 29, 2007 6:02 pm

Jay Miller wrote:Wait, they grow Malbec outside the Touraine? Everyone knows that the best Cot/Malbec is made by Clos Roche Blanche. A 1998 last night was just... just... I'm sorry, I can't go on... so beautiful...


Touraine? You mean Cahors! Specifically, George Vigouroux's Chateau du Haut Serre...the 1990 is drinking very well now. The finest expression of cot (malbec) I have ever encountered. I have to admit, my experience of top-shelf Argentine malbecs is limited to Catena Alta, Weinart, and the work of the nefarious M. Rolland...

Seriously, the wines of Cahors and the wines of Mendoza seem to me to be very different, which is as it should be. I'd like to try a high-end Argentine Malbec that was not created for the international market. Interestingly, M. Vigouroux is now bottling a rose that he is actually labelling as Malbec, which at least demonstrates the primacy of Argentina in marketing terms.
no avatar
User

Bob Parsons Alberta

Rank

aka Doris

Posts

10860

Joined

Tue Mar 21, 2006 3:09 pm

Re: The resurection

by Bob Parsons Alberta » Mon Jan 29, 2007 10:14 pm

James Roscoe wrote:Bob, you are one sick dude. Is it really that cold up on the ranch? What the heck, maybe this proves there really is a life after death. :roll:


JR, your de man!!This Malbec thread has not died/will not go away/will still be active until at least 2008!!!
Last edited by Bob Parsons Alberta on Mon Jan 29, 2007 10:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
no avatar
User

James Roscoe

Rank

Chat Prince

Posts

11057

Joined

Wed Mar 22, 2006 6:43 pm

Location

D.C. Metro Area - Maryland

Re: The resurection

by James Roscoe » Mon Jan 29, 2007 10:28 pm

But as LL points out, it's dicey at the lower price points. I find it somewhat disappointing below $15. That's one of the reasons I think it's a bad recco for the pizza in the other thread. Would you care to prove me wrong? I am always happy to try again. Most of the good malbecs I've had have been over $15.
Yes, and how many deaths will it take 'til he knows
That too many people have died?
The answer, my friend, is blowin' in the wind
The answer is blowin' in the wind.
no avatar
User

Bob Parsons Alberta

Rank

aka Doris

Posts

10860

Joined

Tue Mar 21, 2006 3:09 pm

Re: The resurection

by Bob Parsons Alberta » Mon Jan 29, 2007 10:32 pm

Oh yeah, over $15 ...absolutely. I will continue to stay clear of the others till I get other info. Even at the local tasting bar, we are looking at $20 Cdn plus
no avatar
User

Alejandro Audisio

Rank

Ultra geek

Posts

376

Joined

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:03 am

Location

Buenos Aires, Argentina

Re: The resurection

by Alejandro Audisio » Sat Feb 03, 2007 9:39 am

I share the views of those that say that Malbec (like other varietals) can be found in many different qualities. There is plonk from everywhere, even from regions that are considered the "holy grail" of winemaking.

Generalizations are very dangerous, and leaving conspiracy theories aside, I am of the idea that while its perfectly fine to have everybody voice their own opinion on any given wine, wine producing style, and wine producing region, I also think that its usually best to do so with a degree of respect & decorum. When such opinions get vulgar, insulting, cocky & insolent - focus moves away from wine and concentrates on the "critic" or "consumer" who choose to "publish" them.
PreviousNext

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: ClaudeBot, FB-extagent, Google AgentMatch, Ripe Bot and 0 guests

Powered by phpBB ® | phpBB3 Style by KomiDesign