Loireheads, what's wrong with this sentence?

Dale, did you see my question above about Trebbiano d'Abruzzo?
/Anders

Dale, did you see my question above about Trebbiano d'Abruzzo?
/Anders

Sorry, Anders!

I found the discussion I remembered on AFW:
I think we should disqualify Trebbiano d'Abruzzo (Bombino Bianco), because it seems that it's a different grape than Trebbiano Toscano (Ugni Blanc). There's confirmation on another board from Maurizio Gily, technical director of VignaioliPiemontesi and consulting enologist for Colle Mora of Abruzzo.

Pretty sure that the other board referenced was the old WLDG, and the poster was Luca M. The archived discussions don't go back that far, though. Will see if I can find another source.

I have heard that Trebbiano di Lugana is claimed to actually be Verdicchio, but do you know which grape Trebbiano d'Abruzzo is claimed/found to be. And how sure this is?

I did think about mentioning Valentini's Trebbiano d'A, and have tasted this rather rare wine, but could not understand the fuss about it. Can you?

http://www.vines.org/Docs/Text/VINES.OR ... bbiano.htm

Seems to indicate they don't think that TdA is really Trebbiano/Ugni.

I liked my one taste of Valentini, but not enough to even think of buying at current prices.

http://www.vines.org/Docs/Text/VINES.OR ... bbiano.htm

Seems to indicate they don't think that TdA is really Trebbiano/Ugni.

Thanks, Dale. I'll search around a bit more to see what I can find. BTW, the information on that page was a bit funny. The chart showing the percentage of Trebbiano grown around the world did not include Italy. Even if there's a lot of Ugni blanc out there, I think it must be wrong.
/A

You're right, I just read the text. But the charts make no sense (I wonder if they were lifted from an Italian site, and were originally "Trebbiano outside of Italy" or something like that?).

Thought of 2 other appellations that can make CB that I might call world-class, at least from one producer:
Anjou blanc (as done by Marc Angelli), Coteaux du Loir (as done by Belliviere)

So started thinking who makes world-class CB from each appellation. Here were my candidates (ones in parentheses are good producers, but I might not make the argument for "world class" without hearing a definition):

Vouvray- Huet, Foreau/Clos Naudin (Pinon)
Montlouis- Chidaine
Coteaux de Layon -Moulin Touchais, Pierre-Bise, Baumard
Quarts de Chaume-Baumard (Laffourcade)
Savenierres- Closel, Baumard (Soucherie, Tijou)

A budding French bureaucrat here, just itching to categorize everything in its safe little niche. Can Belgium be in your future????

David, Robin, Tim and Dale:

Silly boys engaged in an exercise of futility.

That was AlexR asking the question.

Fact: there is no world class Chenin Blanc grown in the Bordeaux AC.

It goes without saying, then, that there is no world-class Chenin.

D'oh! (In the world of AlexR)

Dale,

Have you tried Richard Lenoir, in the Layon? I think he's doing very impressive work.

Best,
Cliff

A budding French bureaucrat here, just itching to categorize everything in its safe little niche. Can Belgium be in your future????

Well, I like waterzooi, mussels, carbonade and frites. But think I'll pass.

I'm certainly not looking as my opinions are authoritative. Just thought I'd start a conversation, see what people thought. I'm pretty comfortable with people telling me I'm full of #$%^ (I know for instance there are some Baumard haters out there), but what I really look forward to is other's ideas of what is really good. I know you have nothing to learn about wine, but I am an eager student. I've shared wine with Cliff and respect his tastes, now I have a new producer to look for.

And my other thought re my little list (and previous comments re good producers) is that I expected Alex to come back with "Vouvray? I had a Barton and Guestier Vouvray that sucked, that proves that there are no world class Chenin Blanc, the only World Class Wines Are From Bordeaux" (or a close variant). So I thought a little clarity about what folks were discussing might help.

(edited for a spelling goof)

Dale,

Have you tried Richard Lenoir, in the Layon? I think he's doing very impressive work.

Best,
Cliff

Cliff,
is there a different domaine name or something? Is this imported to US? Winesearcher doesn't show any hits in US, and I don;t see any entries in CT either.

I'm certainly not looking as my opinions are authorative. Just thought I'd start a conversation, see what people thought. I'm pretty comfortable with people telling me I'm full of #$%^ (I know for instance there are some Baumard haters out there), but what I really look forward to is other's ideas of what is really good. I know you have nothing to learn about wine, but I am an eager student. I've shared wine with Cliff and respect his tastes, now I have a new producer to look for.

Whoa, Dude. Just joshing a little. Don't get all defensive on me now. I did not tell you you were full of anything. You may have taken it that way, but I didn't mean it that way. Lighten up.

Whattya mean, I have nothing to learn....I learn something every single day, not least of which how much I don't know.

The game of classification is damn near irresistible, I'll give you that. And a good discussion starter too. Well, except for when people like Joe Perry want to express their opinions, but you can't have everything...

And re Ugnie Blanc...

You doesn't have to call it Ugni Blanc. You can call it Trebbiano (I checked, it was over 80 DOCs listing Trebb), Procanico, St. Emilion, White Hermitage, White Shiraz (!), Thelia, Clairette Ronde, Rossola.....well, the list goes on and on and on. That is one widespread grape. I wonder if it has any profit potential?

Dale,

Have you tried Richard Lenoir, in the Layon? I think he's doing very impressive work.

Best,
Cliff

Cliff,
is there a different domaine name or something? Is this imported to US? Winesearcher doesn't show any hits in US, and I don;t see any entries in CT either.

Oooops! Richard LEROY -- that's the domaine name. David brought two cuvées of 2004 in at Chambers: one I thought was lovely, the other had great potential but the wood was sticking out. I gather they've got a regular importer now, I think Bowler, but I haven't seen the 2005 or 2006. The prices on 2004 were very reasonable. I put notes up directly elsewhere, but here's the Cellartracker info for the version I preferred (http://www.cellartracker.com/wine.asp?iWine=310624)

Robin,

I sold Loire wines for 2 years as export manager of a firm based in Saumur.

I think there are some tremendous values there, probably due to the fact that the wines suffer from an image problem.

However, I must disagree with your assertion that even the best of the Loire stickies can hold a candle to great Sauternes. They are a hell of a lot cheaper, and can last for eons. I like them too. They just don't have the class and complexity is all.

My question had to do with *great* Chenin Blanc. There is one I've heard of, but never had, that apparently fits this description (Cuvée Constance from Huet).

But I have never met a Loire that can look a Bâtard-Montrachet, Chambertin, Lafite, or Yquem in the eye.

Best regards,
Alex R.

Hoke, sorry if I sounded defensive, just trying to avoid being lumped with JP.

Cliff, aha! The Leroy Rouliers Anjou '05 is at WHWC. Prices way up over what '04s were, but still might add a bottle when I ship my Burgs from Woodlands. Thanks

Cliff, aha! The Leroy Rouliers Anjou '05 is at WHWC. Prices way up over what '04s were, but still might add a bottle when I ship my Burgs from Woodlands. Thanks

Bummer about the prices! But it was bound to happen. The 04 Rouliers is seriously good stuff. I may need to do the same as they have a bunch of Burgundy for me as well.

Best,
Cliff

Hoke, sorry if I sounded defensive, just trying to avoid being lumped with JP.

Don't worry, Dale. JP is in a lump all by himself.