The place for all things wine, focused on serious wine discussions.

The view from the other side

Moderators: Jenise, Robin Garr, David M. Bueker

no avatar
User

Jenise

Rank

FLDG Dishwasher

Posts

43610

Joined

Tue Mar 21, 2006 2:45 pm

Location

The Pacific Northest Westest

The view from the other side

by Jenise » Fri May 25, 2007 11:53 am

This is quite funny. A restaurant manager, pressed into wine service for a weekend because his two sommeliers had to become waiters, rants (see the entry for May 18 ):

http://steakhouseblues.blogspot.com/
Last edited by Jenise on Fri May 25, 2007 1:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
My wine shopping and I have never had a problem. Just a perpetual race between the bankruptcy court and Hell.--Rogov
no avatar
User

Mark Lipton

Rank

Oenochemist

Posts

4338

Joined

Wed Mar 22, 2006 1:18 pm

Location

Indiana

Re: The view from the other side

by Mark Lipton » Fri May 25, 2007 12:05 pm

Jenise wrote:This is quite funny. A restaurant manager, pressed into wine service for a weekend because his two sommeliers had to become waiters, rants (see the entry for May 18):


I've never worked as a sommelier, but I can appreciate much of what he says, and thankfully find that I haven't (yet) committed any of those sins when dining out. The only issue I'd take with what he says is when he says that it's only necessary to smell the wine offered for inspection. He's right insofar as cork taint goes, but there are other problems such as heat damage that may not be so apparent if you don't actually taste the wine. That's a quibble, though, and it was funny.

Mark Lipton
no avatar
User

Rahsaan

Rank

Wild and Crazy Guy

Posts

9425

Joined

Tue Mar 28, 2006 8:20 pm

Location

New York, NY

Re: The view from the other side

by Rahsaan » Fri May 25, 2007 12:17 pm

Yes, funny stuff, helped along by his Punchy Language..
no avatar
User

David M. Bueker

Rank

Childless Cat Dad

Posts

34949

Joined

Thu Mar 23, 2006 11:52 am

Location

Connecticut

Re: The view from the other side

by David M. Bueker » Fri May 25, 2007 12:24 pm

There's a whole list of those for transgressions offline where we serve ourselves as well. Among those I have witnessed:

Gathering all the provided bottles to one's self & proclaiming loudly while going through them: "We can drink that. That one's not worth it. We could drink that one, but only if something else is corked. That's a keeper." etc., etc., etc.

"This is really good. What did Parker score it?"

"I need more glasses. Can anybody loan me 4 more glasses" (said by someone with 6 glasses in front of him)

"Why are we drinking white wine? I don't like white wine. Open the reds."

"Champagne is stupid."

"Look, if we have to open the French wine I'm not going to drink it."

The classic line of all time: "This got 98 points from Parker. I've never had it, but figured it was worth a shot." (What, you only normally drink 100 point wines idiot???)

There's so many more it's just sad.
Decisions are made by those who show up
no avatar
User

Paulo in Philly

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

921

Joined

Tue Mar 21, 2006 5:26 pm

Location

Philadelphia, PA

Re: The view from the other side

by Paulo in Philly » Fri May 25, 2007 12:41 pm

Jenise wrote:This is quite funny. A restaurant manager, pressed into wine service for a weekend because his two sommeliers had to become waiters, rants (see the entry for May 18):

http://steakhouseblues.blogspot.com/


Very funny, Jenise! :lol:

I also enjoyed the post about the VP getting fired from his company.
no avatar
User

Jon Peterson

Rank

The Court Winer

Posts

2981

Joined

Sat Apr 08, 2006 5:53 pm

Location

The Blue Crab State

Re: The view from the other side

by Jon Peterson » Fri May 25, 2007 2:40 pm

Jenise, it is funny stuff. But it's also good to read about the other side of the restaurant business. Although I do not think I've committed any of the sins mentioned, I will no doubt be more conscious of the individual pouring at my table next time.
no avatar
User

Oliver McCrum

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

1076

Joined

Wed Mar 22, 2006 1:08 am

Location

Oakland, CA; Cigliè, Piedmont

Re: The view from the other side

by Oliver McCrum » Fri May 25, 2007 2:51 pm

'5. You use the word "connoisseur". "Connoisseur" is French for "douche bag"'

This is very funny. Anyone who refers to themselves as a connoisseur should be taken out and shot.
Oliver
Oliver McCrum Wines
no avatar
User

Keith M

Rank

Beer Explorer

Posts

1184

Joined

Sat Jan 06, 2007 2:25 am

Location

Finger Lakes, New York

Re: The view from the other side

by Keith M » Fri May 25, 2007 3:06 pm

Jenise wrote:This is quite funny. A restaurant manager, pressed into wine service for a weekend because his two sommeliers had to become waiters, rants


Wow. Talk about a diametrically-opposed reaction . . . I actually got upset reading this and failed to see the humor. I find it ironic that the author begins the diatribe with "I do believe that there is a certain, growing segment of the population that thrives on demeaning others whenever possible.", when, correct me if I'm wrong, that is all the rant itself amounts to.

I guess I have strong feelings about this because I have worked in the service industry, and people who see their customers in the light that this restaurant manager evidently does miss the point and really need to find another line of work if they hope to remain sane. What are the trangressions that amount to "vomiting forth the most inane, ridiculously false pronouncements imaginable"? not knowing that the wine needs more contact with air than the diameter at the top of the bottle will allow, perhaps asking another guest to also sample the wine (which seems reasonable to me, as I am pretty good at identifying some wine faults straightaway, but luckily defunct at noting TCA), or using one's hand to signal a desire for no more wine? (I certainly didn't appreciate this as a server, either, but I understand that people do it both to signal to the server without interrupting their conversation and, quite frankly, it overcomes language barriers that often exist in the service industry).

The real question is whether the manager raised the salaries of his service staff who deal with the realities of customer service everyday and not just in a one-night emergency situation.

My rant is complete.
no avatar
User

Redwinger

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

4038

Joined

Wed Mar 22, 2006 2:36 pm

Location

Way Down South In Indiana, USA

Re: The view from the other side

by Redwinger » Fri May 25, 2007 3:07 pm

Pretty funny stuff, however I'll be contrarian here. I couldn't help but think he might just be in the wrong business if he holds a significant portion of his customer base in such low regard.
For the record I don't believe I've committed any of the sins mentioned although a few times when and overly pompous somm. has handed me the cork, I've popped it in my mouth and mumbled something like "Hmm,good". This is quickly followed by an admonition from NJ not to be such an asshat.
BP
Smile, it gives your face something to do!
no avatar
User

Redwinger

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

4038

Joined

Wed Mar 22, 2006 2:36 pm

Location

Way Down South In Indiana, USA

Re: The view from the other side

by Redwinger » Fri May 25, 2007 3:08 pm

Keith,
You nailed it!
Smile, it gives your face something to do!
no avatar
User

Keith M

Rank

Beer Explorer

Posts

1184

Joined

Sat Jan 06, 2007 2:25 am

Location

Finger Lakes, New York

Re: The view from the other side

by Keith M » Fri May 25, 2007 3:13 pm

Redwinger wrote:overly pompous somm. has handed me the cork, I've popped it in my mouth and mumbled something like "Hmm,good".


Okay, now I'm laughing out loud!
no avatar
User

Paulo in Philly

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

921

Joined

Tue Mar 21, 2006 5:26 pm

Location

Philadelphia, PA

Re: The view from the other side

by Paulo in Philly » Fri May 25, 2007 3:25 pm

Keith M wrote:
Redwinger wrote:overly pompous somm. has handed me the cork, I've popped it in my mouth and mumbled something like "Hmm,good".


Okay, now I'm laughing out loud!


That is indeed hilarious. I think I'll do that next time I am in that situation!!! :lol:
no avatar
User

Oliver McCrum

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

1076

Joined

Wed Mar 22, 2006 1:08 am

Location

Oakland, CA; Cigliè, Piedmont

Re: The view from the other side

by Oliver McCrum » Fri May 25, 2007 6:25 pm

Redwinger wrote:Pretty funny stuff, however I'll be contrarian here. I couldn't help but think he might just be in the wrong business if he holds a significant portion of his customer base in such low regard.


I don't think 'The vast majority of the guests were great' counts as denigrating 'a significant portion' of his customers; in fact rather the reverse.
Oliver
Oliver McCrum Wines
no avatar
User

Jenise

Rank

FLDG Dishwasher

Posts

43610

Joined

Tue Mar 21, 2006 2:45 pm

Location

The Pacific Northest Westest

Re: The view from the other side

by Jenise » Fri May 25, 2007 7:15 pm

Oliver McCrum wrote:
Redwinger wrote:Pretty funny stuff, however I'll be contrarian here. I couldn't help but think he might just be in the wrong business if he holds a significant portion of his customer base in such low regard.


I don't think 'The vast majority of the guests were great' counts as denigrating 'a significant portion' of his customers; in fact rather the reverse.


Oliver, I'm with you. In fact, I read it the first time because a friend sent it to me, then I read it a second time before I posted just to make sure I wasn't going to be 'asking for it' by posting this. There's always someone who will take exception to this kind of thing for one reason or another. But nope, it passed my sniff test. I didn't think he was denigrating at all. It is simply the exasperated musings of the kind anyone in a service-oriented line of work can and will prattle off about the customers they serve because let's face it, a lot of people don't know how to be good customers.
My wine shopping and I have never had a problem. Just a perpetual race between the bankruptcy court and Hell.--Rogov
no avatar
User

Kyrstyn Kralovec

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

616

Joined

Mon Nov 20, 2006 3:50 pm

Location

Washington DC, Oregon bound

Re: The view from the other side

by Kyrstyn Kralovec » Fri May 25, 2007 7:16 pm

I've placed my hand over the top of the glass, but also said, "No thank you" and made eye contact at the same time. I just talk with my hands a lot.
I swear, by my life and my love of it, that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine. ~John Galt
no avatar
User

Brian K Miller

Rank

Passionate Arboisphile

Posts

9340

Joined

Fri Aug 25, 2006 1:05 am

Location

Northern California

Re: The view from the other side

by Brian K Miller » Fri May 25, 2007 7:34 pm

Every field that involves contaqct with the public involves some degree of obnoxious behavior. This is just his blow-off-the-steam site. It is funny. :)

I have to confess, I have used the cover the glass with my hand move. I always thought it was standard etiquette/symbol :)
...(Humans) are unique in our capacity to construct realities at utter odds with reality. Dogs dream and dolphins imagine, but only humans are deluded. –Jacob Bacharach
no avatar
User

Redwinger

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

4038

Joined

Wed Mar 22, 2006 2:36 pm

Location

Way Down South In Indiana, USA

Re: The view from the other side

by Redwinger » Fri May 25, 2007 7:50 pm

Oliver,
Just remember everything before the "but" is bullshit. Maybe this person had a bad day...maybe they have a shiity day everyday. We'll never know, but I'd never post stuff like this on a blog...assuming I knew how to blog.
BP
Smile, it gives your face something to do!
no avatar
User

Redwinger

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

4038

Joined

Wed Mar 22, 2006 2:36 pm

Location

Way Down South In Indiana, USA

Re: The view from the other side

by Redwinger » Fri May 25, 2007 7:55 pm

Jenise,
What's the fun of posting these musings if everyone agreed with it?
BP
Smile, it gives your face something to do!
no avatar
User

Isaac

Rank

Ultra geek

Posts

304

Joined

Thu Mar 30, 2006 6:08 pm

Location

Corvallis, Oregon

Re: The view from the other side

by Isaac » Sat May 26, 2007 10:59 am

I found it interesting that he said he'd serve people he believes are murderers, people convicted of major crimes, even Nancy Pelosi, whom he believes to be a traitor to our country, but "don't get me started on the Clintons".
no avatar
User

Bob Ross

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

5703

Joined

Sun Mar 26, 2006 10:39 pm

Location

Franklin Lakes, NJ

Re: The view from the other side

by Bob Ross » Sat May 26, 2007 11:51 am

Jenise, thanks for posting this piece -- interesting musing by a pro who is either having a pretty bad patch or may be facing burnout, at least in the short run.

I was struck by his ninth point:

"9. You demand a new set of glasses with every successive bottle of the same wine, because "the wine has changed and you can't mix them". Once again, your mouth is way ahead of your tiny little lottery-winner brain. Wine is constantly evolving, whether in the glass, the bottle, or in a decanter. The process of drinking and pouring even one bottle of wine displays nearly incalculable variations of the wine in that bottle--its part of the reason for drinking it in the first place. If you haven't greased the glass up with your grubby paws and there hasn't been any surprise sediment, there is very rarely any reason to have fresh glasses for newly-ordered bottles of the same wine."

I've requested a new set of glasses with each new bottle of wine -- unless the sommelier offers them as a matter of course -- and it's been several months since I've had to ask for fresh glasses. There is always bottle variation, and even if there isn't any, it can be great fun to compare a wine that's been in the glass for 30 to 40 minutes with wine form a newly poured bottle.

He really makes my point himself: "Wine is constantly evolving, whether in the glass, the bottle, or in a decanter. The process of drinking and pouring even one bottle of wine displays nearly incalculable variations of the wine in that bottle..."

Why would any sommelier who believes that pour the new wine into a glass containing wine from the previous bottle, or even an empty glass with all of the aromas that remain from the first glass.

I'm going to post this note on his site and see what his reaction is.

Again, thanks for posting -- it's always instructional, sometimes amusing, sometimes horrifying, to see ourselves as others see us.

Regards, Bob
no avatar
User

Robin Garr

Rank

Forum Janitor

Posts

21719

Joined

Fri Feb 17, 2006 1:44 pm

Location

Louisville, KY

Re: The view from the other side

by Robin Garr » Sat May 26, 2007 12:03 pm

Jenise wrote:Oliver, I'm with you. In fact, I read it the first time because a friend sent it to me, then I read it a second time before I posted just to make sure I wasn't going to be 'asking for it' by posting this. There's always someone who will take exception to this kind of thing for one reason or another. But nope, it passed my sniff test. I didn't think he was denigrating at all. It is simply the exasperated musings of the kind anyone in a service-oriented line of work can and will prattle off about the customers they serve because let's face it, a lot of people don't know how to be good customers.


I'm going to fall somewhere in the middle on this one. I agree that people in any serve-the-public business - from waitstaff to journalists to cops - blows off steam in private by making fun of the masses. It's just human nature.

But, maybe because I'm close to the restaurant business when wearing another of my hats, I also felt a little of the same unease as I think Bill and Keith did when I read it. This guy is so bitter that it has to make me wonder how well he can do his job with that much negativism toward the people he serves.

It was a great article, and I for one am glad you posted it, Jenise. And to be honest, I laughed more than I winced when reading it. But I don't think you should ever worry about whether to post something just because it's controversial. Discussing and even debating the contents is no criticism of the poster!
no avatar
User

ClarkDGigHbr

Rank

Ultra geek

Posts

481

Joined

Sat May 06, 2006 7:16 pm

Location

Gig Harbor, WA

Re: The view from the other side

by ClarkDGigHbr » Sat May 26, 2007 12:11 pm

Brian K Miller wrote:Every field that involves contact with the public involves some degree of obnoxious behavior. This is just his blow-off-the-steam site.


At first I also wondered why the author worked in this business while harboring such a fundamental dislike for people. However, after reading further, I have to agree with you. Too many people are rude and ignorant beyond comprehension, and the problem just seems to get worse over time. The author obviously has very limited opportunity to address this during work hours, and needs to have some form of a "safe" release. Hence, the blog ...

I loved the story about the special bottle of wine for the couple celebrating their anniversary. It was very touching, and really showed the caring and human side of this person.

-- Clark
no avatar
User

Steve Slatcher

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

1047

Joined

Sat Aug 19, 2006 11:51 am

Location

Manchester, England

Re: The view from the other side

by Steve Slatcher » Sat May 26, 2007 12:21 pm

Brian K Miller wrote:I have to confess, I have used the cover the glass with my hand move. I always thought it was standard etiquette/symbol :)

The situation rarely occurs with me :) .

There's no excuse for rudeness to staff, but waiters also have to realise that sometimes their customers are in the middle of a conversation, or chewing food, when approached. And from my observations, if nothing is said or done the glass gets topped up.

I also have some sympathy with the view that if I order a bottle of wine I expect the restaurant to deliver that bottle without being hassled to verify that the bottle is correct. The food is not held up for your nod before being placed on the table. Of course there can be large financial consequences if the wrong bottle is opened, but the communication could be straightened out at the time of ordering. And the bottle does not come with a price tag when you approve it anyway!

I am also reminded of an experience when I saw "Chateau Margaux,1er Cru" on the wine list for £85. I suspected a mistake, but ordered it anyway. When it was presented, the waiter's hand was partly obscuring the label. It was only when I peered to inspect the label that he removed his hand to reveal the words "Pavillon Rouge". I was not impressed.
no avatar
User

Peter May

Rank

Pinotage Advocate

Posts

3905

Joined

Mon Mar 20, 2006 11:24 am

Location

Snorbens, England

Re: The view from the other side

by Peter May » Sat May 26, 2007 12:49 pm

Did anyone read the 5 March entry? The first two paragraphs are

An old colleague of mine long since moved to another industry recently asked me what group of diners I dislike the most. As this is a question that begs steroetyping, he was fully expecting that my answer would be based on race, religion, or possibly even sexual orientation. He also expected a good deal of hemming, hawing, and qualifying. What he did not expect was the immediate, fierce response nearly spit from between my lips--"corkage people!".

I despise no group of diners more than those that attempt to bring their own wine to dinner with them. The act itself is rooted in arrogance, pomposity, condescension, and cheapness. Somehow these people have convinced themselves that they are the very apex of the dining public and that their patronage is to be sought after and cherished. The reality is that these self-important asswipes are the last people any respectful and successful restaurant wants to see.
Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: AhrefsBot, ByteSpider, ClaudeBot and 0 guests

Powered by phpBB ® | phpBB3 Style by KomiDesign