"Bulk Wine"?

In the age of Costco, Sam’s Cub and BJ’s (wholesale shopping or “bulk” shopping seems like the norm in today’s day and age). Shipping in “bulk” seems like the “in thing” to do both economically and environmentally.
What is the definition of “bulk wine” today?

Salute

[David M. Bueker]

A retail definition or wholesale?

Does it matter? I would assume it only has to do with volume and size (type) of container (for retail it would be “amount of servings”, let’s say 2 liters (Big Boss) or more).

Salute

[Robin Garr]

Victor, I think of "bulk wine" as the rough equivalent of vin ordinaire. Without specific regard to its quality, wine not grown in vineyards so noteworthy that they deserve being treated separately and recognized on the lable with an AOC/AVA/geographical designation, much less vineyard status.

Say "bulk wine" and I think of Charles Shaw, Trader Joe's notorious "Two Buck Chuck," which is bottled and labeled from whatever juice the last fleet of tank cars brought in. Or, for that matter, the wines bearing labels of vineyards never seen or heard of before that are being promoted by some Internet retailers like Last Bottle, the subject of discussion in another recent discussion.

The good folks at California Wine Club, one of our major advertising partners, make a big deal out of choosing only wines from "Mom n Pop" wineries that exist in the real world, not "bulk wine."

It's definitely a pejorative in my wine dictionary, not a mere description of provenance or shipping method.

It's clear from the comments that the first step in this post is to clarify what bulk wine is. It has nothing to do with a Costco esque buying in bulk notion, it's simply a supply and demand market. For example, we've had abundant vintages recently and growers may find that wineries can only accept grapes they've contracted for. Multiply that across many wineries and the grower may decide to custom crush and make wine that can be sold in the bulk market -- say to a winery that has plenty of Chardonnay but has a growing demand for Cabernet, and needs more juice. This happens not just to farmers (and wineries who farm their own vineyards) in modest appellations, it happens in Napa and everywhere else. Another example: a winery may find it has plenty of juice for its top line wines, but not enough juice for its middle tier. A trade in the bulk market may result, with top notch wine sold, and more affordable juice purchased for need.

This is insider baseball, and there's an air of secrecy about it. A wonderful negociant like Cameron Hughes may careful sample hundreds of bulk wine samples from the finest vineyards to create his portfolio of solid wines at solid prices. Without this balancing market, it wouldn't be possible.

There is certainly more vin ordinaire by volume than incredible juice, but it's there...and today's vin ordinaire has grown in quality by leaps and bounds so the implications of that definition need to be revisited as well. We should all be able to drink tasty wines at tasty prices.

So no, bulk doesn't mean buying bladders of wine...although that's another subject worth exploring.

From an amateur winemakers perception even DRC, and Chateau Lafite (technically) start off as a “bulk wine”.

Salute

I don't see how DRC or Lafite (or any estate grown wine) qualifies as bulk, by any definition I've ever heard. Bulk wine historically refers to wine sold and transported in bulk containers as opposed to individual bottles. That could be as small as a barrel but typically in modern terms tankers. It's priced as a commodity. Prices vary according to demand for that wine- blended red wine would be super cheap, less popular red varietals a bit more, PN and CS more than that. Geographic specificity (Napa CS) will drive prices up more.

Bulk wine historically refers to wine sold and transported in bulk containers as opposed to individual bottles.

So why can’t “bulk wine” refer to wine in “bulk containers”?

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[David M. Bueker]

Why does it matter?

Why not refer to 3L retail BiB(if that is what you are talking about) as "boxed wine" since that is the established industry term, rather than use "bulk wine" which is an established term in the industry with a different meaning?

Bulk = unbottled.
Best, Jim

Bulk wine historically refers to wine sold and transported in bulk containers as opposed to individual bottles.

That is what I thought was still the case, and where the container is more like a large tank than bag-in-box. It is wine for large scale blending, or if retail the customer fills his own bottles.

(Hence our misunderstanding when discussing Sicily bulk wine, because for quite a few decades last century that is pretty much what Sicily did.)

Bulk wine to my understanding means not yet bottled wine bought in quantity from producers by middle-middle men who at some stage bottle it for retail sale without indication of the actual winery/vineyard it comes from.

For many years there has been a ‘bulk wine’ category on the South African web-site for the trading of bulk wine, e.g on the site today ‘We require 14000 litres of 2013 or 2014 Pinotage / Shiraz or Mouvedre rose’. Such wines are then sold on, shipped in bulk, and bottled under shipper labels for restaurants, supermarkets etc.

Bulk shipped wine is wine that is not bottled by the producer but shipped, usually these days, in a bladder that fills a shipping container. We’re seeing a lot of this now from the southern hemisphere because it cuts shipping costs. Its sold on so called ‘green’ arguments but the fact that where its bottled is hidden away on the label and the shipping method is not mentioned on the label suggests that ‘green’ has nothing to do with it and it’s the bottom line that is the only factor.

I like Florida Jim’s answer, but besides just “bottled”, I think volume should also be considered. Not all “bulk wine” is meant for blending. Take California “bulk wine” (or “bulk California grapes”), if the “bulk” wine (or “bulk” grapes) is shipped (and “finished and bottled” (or the wine is made) outside California) to a state that is continuous with California (bordering or touching it) I believe “California wine” could be stated on the label. If the “bulk wine is shipped (and “finished and bottled”) to a state not continuous with California (New York for instance) “California wine” can not (or should not) be put on the label but “American wine” is acceptable.

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[David M. Bueker]

Still trying to figure out why this matters.

Bulk = unbottled.
Best, Jim

Exactly.

Not all “bulk wine” is meant for blending.

I agree, and take back that bit of my last attempt of a description. I liked Peter's defnition.

Bulk shipped wine is wine that is not bottled by the producer but shipped, usually these days, in a bladder that fills a shipping container. We’re seeing a lot of this now from the southern hemisphere because it cuts shipping costs. Its sold on so called ‘green’ arguments but the fact that where its bottled is hidden away on the label and the shipping method is not mentioned on the label suggests that ‘green’ has nothing to do with it and it’s the bottom line that is the only factor.

About 1/3 of the weight of a shipping container full of bottled wine is glass, which means that anyone who ships wine in bulk is in fact hugely improving their environmental footprint, whatever their motive. There is no reason I can think of why the shipping method should be mentioned on the label.

We've looked at shipping wine from Italy this way and 'bottling' it in kegs, specifically to improve our process. In our case at least green would have everything to do with it. (In this case it would be sold with the producers name on it, though, unlike most bulk wine.)

Like David I'm really struggling to understand this thread.

Bulk wine really has nothing to do with Sam's, Costco, etc. and it existed long before these retailers.

I think industrial wine and Sam's, Costco, etc. is a better fit.

When we hear the term “bulk wine” we shouldn’t just think of Bronco Wines (“Two-Buck Chuck”), just your average “plonK” or so called “blending wine”. As far as “virtual wineries” go, the concept is not all that new, “negotiate brands” and “shipper brands” have been around for centuries. With the abundant grape crops of the last several decades we have seen the number of “virtual wineries” grow enormously. Yes quite a few are just “brand names” of the “big boys”, but others could be “smaller” (Mom and Pop) producers who rely on “outsourcing” and custom crush facilities or smaller “wine-broker” outfits just searching for the “incredible bulk wine” out there . It’s not the “quality” of the wine that determines how an “American wine” or “bulk wine” is possible labeled (no vintage date, the broadest of geographical indication) it’s man-made rules and regulations governing how “bulk wine” or “American wine” is labeled.

Salute

When we hear the term “bulk wine” we shouldn’t just think of Bronco Wines (“Two-Buck Chuck”), just your average “plonK” or so called “blending wine”. As far as “virtual wineries” go, the concept is not all that new, “negotiate brands” and “shipper brands” have been around for centuries. With the abundant grape crops of the last several decades we have seen the number of “virtual wineries” grow enormously. Yes quite a few are just “brand names” of the “big boys”, but others could be “smaller” (Mom and Pop) producers who rely on “outsourcing” and custom crush facilities or smaller “wine-broker” outfits just searching for the “incredible bulk wine” out there . It’s not the “quality” of the wine that determines how an “American wine” or “bulk wine” is possible labeled (no vintage date, the broadest of geographical indication) it’s man-made rules and regulations governing how “bulk wine” or “American wine” is labeled.

Salute

But what does this have to do with Sam's, Costco, etc.?

Go back and read your first post. You asked us if Sams/Costco have changed the definition of bulk wines yet you say that negociant and shipper wines have been around for centuries and "virtual wines" are largely the result of abundant crops - so I'm really struggling to understand the Sam's/Costco connection to all of this.

As Jim Caudill pointed out “there is a secrecy about” the “bulk” wine market, and most people don’t understand it (people only think of “bulk” wine in the negative). But in today’s day and age most people could relate to “bulk” shopping in places like Costco, Sam’s Club, and BJ’s, where instead of paying $2.00 USD for a single roll of Bounty paper towels you can buy a “bulk” pack of ten rolls for $10.00 USD. (Most people do not think of “bulk” shopping in the negative. Why think of “bulk” wine only in the negative?).

Salute

[Robin Garr]

Why think of “bulk” wine only in the negative?).

Speaking for wine geeks, I'd say it goes back to valuing the appellation. "Bulk" wine in the traditional sense is anonymous, wine that for whatever reason is disposed of in quantity for generic labeling.

There are certainly exceptions in the current marketplace, but that's the best answer I've got to this question.

It was my understanding that years ago when Ravenswood was purchased from it's original owners the simple Ravenwoods Zin was then changed and production increased by purchasing bulk juice.