Open Mike: Douro table wines.

I think that Bob’s thread “Douro red table wines” deserves being amplified into an Open Mike.

Given the splendours of the best vintage and tawny (especially Colheita) port, I have thought for years that there must be potential in the Douro region for great red table wines. Now that an increasing number of such Douro wines are available (at least here), it is worth exploring whether that potential is being realised.

Prices here range from less than 4 EUR to over 40 EUR. Towards the top of that range, the wines should be rivalling the quality of Port in their own style. Let us see whether we find any which do so.

At the lower end of the range we should be looking for wines which provide QPR drinking pleasure to rival or surpass that of, for example, lesser Bordeaux, Montepulciano d’Abruzzo, lesser Chianti Classico and Chianti Colli Senesi, lower and mid-range Rioja, Côtes du Rhône Villages and so on.

I know very little about the Douro region so the best that I can do to provide background is to repeat the links already given in Bob’s thread.

First a survey by the admirable Jamie Goode - http://www.wineanorak.com/douro_overview1.htm

And next two reports, excellent as usual, from Robin - http://www.wineloverspage.com/wines/port121405.phtml
http://www.wineloverspage.com/wines/port121505.phtml


In the next few hours, I hope to write up and post WTNs, first, on a Douro at the lower end of the price range (approx EUR which does punch its weight as a QPR rival compared with the regions mentioned above and, second, on a much more ambitious example (approx 35 EUR) which, IMHO, does not yet quite make the grade.

So, forumites, please join in. And, if anyone (myself included) wishes to slip in a white or, for comparison, a Spanish neighbour from the upstream Duero, so much the better.

Great initiative Tim. I am very fortunate to have a winestore in town that has the best Portugal selection anywhere in Canada. One of the owners is from that country so a treat in store for anyone looking for something a little different. Sure, one has to do some research but hand-selling seems to pay off as well and a few opened bottles on the tasting counter will always help in the salesmanship!! Here is one red that is quality plus and should be available in your area.

WTN: `03 Symington Douro Altano Reserva.

A blend of Tinta Roriz and Touriga Franca, and usually around $15 Cdn. The color is a deepish red ruby and on the nose I found cherry, strawberry and some earthyness. Maybe one of the few reds fron Portugal that can be enjoyed without food, palate is strong on sour cherry with raspberry and spice. This Douro red seems to get sweeter as it breathes, medium-bodied and tannins not too overpowering.
Always a consistent wine, good price and nice looking package. Certainly a good introduction before opening the bigger style of wine that beckons!

WTN: Duas Quintas – Douro DOC – 2005 from Ramos Pinto, V.N. Gaia. Alc. 13.5% (EUR 8,40).


The two quintas in question are Quinta d’Ervamoira, on shale, and Quinta Bons Ares, on gravel. The back label claims a perfect marriage of the qualities of each terroir.

C: Deep red.
N: Vigorous red fruit with an ivy tang.
P: Robust tasty red fruit, more savoury than sweet, with good body, depth and mouth-fill and that attractive tang, which for want of a really good descriptor I call “ivy”.

I really like this honest, straightforward and sensibly priced wine, which is at least the equal of most I know at a similar price; 15.5/20.

I know that there are two more ambitious cuvées from Ramos Pinto, both of which is available from where I bought this bottle with the top one costing over 40 EUR. If the others are heavily wooded, I could well prefer this one. I tried to find out more about them on http://www.ramospinto.pt but could not get beyond the home page.





WTN: Quinta da Gaivosa Douro DOC 1999- Alc. 13.5% - (EUR 35 approx for current vintage).


C: Deep ruby.

N: Quite subdued but complex dark fruit, cherry with kirsch hints, sweet raspberry, plum and so on and (am I imagining it?) a dash of port.

P: “Wow” was the first impression. Deep, rich, complex, seamless fruit with a polished patina and good structure, mouth-shape and length with a dash of saddle and a dying hint of caramel at the finish but integrated and inoffensive. However as the bottle progressed no additional subtleties showed other than some liqueur notes and the wine did not consolidate its initial level of interest.

Very nice but not compelling like a fine Port (for those familiar with classical music it reminds me of the polished but undemanding beauty of Mendelssohn compared with the profundity of Brahms). Of course an 8 years old would a baby for vintage Port and maybe this one will get there with time. I wonder? 16/20.

Here is the estate’s website http://www.alvesdesousa.com/.

2 nice wines from Tim, great start! Last week at the Portugal tasting downtown, I noted some vague port-like notes with a couple of the wines tasted. Basically the same grape varieties could be a clue especially as many red wine producers here also dabble in some port production!!

Tim wrote......[i]Prices here range from less than 4 EUR to over 40 EUR. Towards the top of that range, the wines should be rivalling the quality of Port in their own style. Let us see whether we find any which do

The recent wine festival tasting I posted on, a lot of the higher end wines sure needed some time in the cellar. Tim, we are counting on you to find those wines that are drinking nicely now!!

Repost from the other Douro thread>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.

`01 Sogrape Reserva Old vines. Pretty well available everywhere I think and great drink now for under $20 Cdn. Buy!

`05 Malvis, Quinta do Portal. Entry level for about $14 Cdn, nice easy drinking, good fruit expression.

`03 Tinta Roriz da Urze. 4 wines served from this winery. Modern packaging, all good but need time.

`03 CARM Reserva. Organic, port-like nose. Big finish, needs cellaring. Will be good.

`05 Quinta do Coa. CARM product, needs 5 yrs. Can one wait, lovely, smooth tannins but unbalanced as of now.

`04 Meandro Do Vale Meao..Think have seen notes here? Big wine for the future. Black fruits/brambleberry, bit of heat now but will come around.

`05 Luis Pato Beiras Old Vines Great products from here, traditional winery I think. Birds on all labels! Single vineyard, cherry, raspberry. Good mid-palate and finish. Riper than most, needs time. http://www.luispato.com

10 Yr Old Justinos Madeira. Lovely but not enough to go around as I came late. Celery in nose unusual, big hit I was told.

`97 LBV Quinta da Noval. As many know I am a big fan of this winery but this LBV is starting to do downhill. Was the earlier shipment 3 yrs ago better??? Have 6 splits in the cellar, might be Xmas presents!! I will open another this week.

`03 Quinta do Portal VP. So not one of the big names but one to drink now. Lovely, could be under $50 I feel?

Many other wines to taste but would have needed more stamina and time!

Jamie Goode has just posted some new Douro notes on his blog. Scroll down to Oct 30 and 31. Pic of a good looking winemaker too!!!

http://www.wineanorak.com/blog/

And here is a link to an article by Jancis R http://www.jancisrobinson.com/articles/winenews050205

She refers to the flagship red Douro, Barca Velha, of which I once had a bottle of 1985, I think, which I shared with some friends at a Portuguese evening. I think that it was an "off" bottle which I recall as elegant but lacking in stuffing.

HRH Jancis has a pretty good sum up there! I have had some experience with Barca Velha, used to bring them back from London in the early `90s. The price these days here in oil-land are too high for me.

There is not much of a Portugal choice in the regular liquor stores here in Alberta and it is all generally entry level stuff. Even some of the high-end stores have a lousy selection. "Cannot sell the longer term wines" I was told.
Hopefully this OM will create some interest here on this forum!

WTN: `04 Quinta do Crasto Reserva Old Vines.

My second bottle of three! Owned by the Roquette family, new winemaker is Dominic Miller from land of Oz. Maybe a new direction in the coming years?

Blend of mainly Tinta Roriz and Touriga Nacional, foot-treading in lagares.
Bottled unfiltered, good natural cork, 14.5% alc, $26 Cdn. Expect this wine to be very expressive of the Douro!

Color. Dark purple, no red hints and no sign of age. The centre is getting close to being almost opaque.

Nose. Violets, cherry, berry fruits. Fresh, lively, hint of chocolate, oak and spice. No pepper and not much of a change after decanting for 3 hrs.

Palate. Initial mouthfeel entry is ripe black fruits, soft tannins, smooth and drinks nicely. Giving it some time, noted silky/mocha/port-like/no heat.
Very nice balance`twixt the alcohol, the spice and the ripe fruit. Better half thought "cherry, plum some might think more of a modern style" but she has thought that before!
After 24 hrs, I was afraid of a downward closing trend but held up pretty well on further reflection. I did notice vanilla and coconut on the nose (how did I miss that last night?). Took into DeVines and staff thought top-notch, so there!

Re: Q. Crasto -

Sounds good. I must look for one of these.

Still hanging in after 2 days! Back to beer and rye as the rodeo is up and running and a full house here at Doris Ranch. 14,000 for opening night, over at the Coliseum not here!!

Re: Q. Crasto -

Sounds good. I must look for one of these.

Tim.

Roy Hersch was in town today and I had a chance to briefly meet up with him after a Taylor tasting. He waxes lyrical about anything Crasto and he also mentioned to watch out for the `07 Douro red table wines when they come out. Good heads up eh.
Right now, am finishing off a split of the `97 Noval LBV. Still hanging in after that bad bottle the other week!

Bob P

WTN: Altano 2005 Douro DOC - Symington Family Estates (<EUR5)

C: Good sustained red.
N: Not big but attractive red fruit.
P: Again not big but very sound and pleasantly fruity and full with good grip and a touch of not displeasing rustic coarseness and a good match for tasty plain food.

Less personality than the Duas Quintas of a few days ago but at only two-thirds of the price. I think that it does a similar job to a good Montepulciano d'Abruzzo or CDRV in the same price range.

Let us have some more WTNs on Douro, forumites. When something suitable is on the menu, I will raid my cellar for an up-market one from the mid-90s which should say something about ageing potential.

I'm a fan of Quinta do Crasto wines. Their flagship Vinha da Ponte (vintage 2000) was sensational in a tasting I held with friends in August of 2004, beating out (among those present) the also excellent 2001 Douro Chryseia 2000 Quinta do Vale Meão. The 2000 Crasto Reserva was delicious in February of 2006, again more impressive than the competition (1999 Luis Pato Vinha Pan, 2000 Niepoort Redoma and 2003 Santos Lima Touriz). They also make a wonderful Touriga Nacional. I have half a dozen bottles of the 2003 and 2004 Crasto Reserva Old Vines stashed away; the few I've already opened have yet to match the 2000.

Tim wrote.....Let us have some more WTNs on Douro, forumites. I think we will get some more notes, we have 6 months of winter to come. Great time for the Duoro and the corkscrew!

Oswaldo. Great to have your imput, must dig out my notes for other Crasto TNs I have around here. I would be opening more reds from the Duoro but am also interested in the Rhone thread here on Wine Focus!!
I have always heard great things about the `00 Crasto reserva. Are you familiar with Quinta de Ventozelo?

WTN: `04 Quinta de Roriz Douro Prazo de Roriz.

Local winebar had a bottle open so slapped down my eight dollars. Always a bottle somewhere at home! The Reserve is an amazing wine in my books, if you can find it.

Color was a darkish red w. purple tinges on the rim. On the nose, we found spice (cinnamon), leather, dark berry fruits, cherry. Soft tannins, great fruit balance, smoothie! Blueberry, blackberry on mid-palate, tad modern in style one comment? Not as rustic as an `02, some may think bit too ripe but OK by me! Pepper and raspberry on a lingering finish, nice.
Bar staff said "bottle open 3 hours". Nice evolvement.

Hi, Bob, my pleasure! Never tried Quinta do Ventozelo, should I? I tried half a dozen bottles of Prazo de Rouriz 2004 over the last year, but was disappointed. Seemed good quality but a a bit monolithic (yes, a bit too new world), maybe tried it at the wrong point of the curve.

I'm still in search of the two wonderful 2000 Crasto experiences with later vintages, but I think that around that time they reorganized their cuvees to creat more high end bottlings like Touriga Nacional, Tinta Roriz and Vinha Maria Teresa. This may have redirected some of the better grapes away from the more middle level bottlings. The non-reserva Crastos have, alas, always been disappoitments in all the vintages I've tried, so I tend to steer clear of those..

Bill has just posted another note on the `00 Crasto! He is hooked too.
Seems he had a nice evening with only one dud.

Velha Porca de Murca Reserva Tinto 2003

DOC Douro.
Real Companhia Velha.

A blend of Touriga Nacional, Touriga Francesa and Tinta Roriz .

Dark purple in the glass.

A rich nose of chocolate, earth and tangy-spicy hickory smoke.

Thick and rich in the mouth, pencil lead, chocolate, fleshy plum and black cherries, dry, tangy BBQ sauce, with a bit of heat toward the end. Overall, the wine exhibited a rather lean structure, with a bit of an edge.

Drying finish.

Purchased at $17.95 (Canadian).

I had bought the red after having greatly enjoyed the Porca de Murca Branco, but I didn't care for this as much.

Thanks for this note Bruce, not familiar with this winery. Pity about the finish, do you think poor storage somewhere?

http://www.realcompanhiavelha.pt/i_vinhodoporto.cfm

In honor of this thread, tonight I opened a half bottle of the regular (not Reserva) Crasto 2004 and was quite impressed. The nose is straightforward vanilla & cherry, and the taste adds some chocolate, but the fruit and acid are in perfect balance, and the overall impression was very satisfying. This bodes well for the future of the 2004 Reserva V.V.

Thanks OC, Have seen the regular Crasto but always seem the buy the VV or Reserva. Will get one tomorrow!

One glass only after a phone call from agent out in the west end who knew I was buying Douro after I emailed her!!!

WTN: `04 Quinta do Vale Meao Douro Meandro.

Serious wine this as have sampled during a tasting last year but no notes at the time.

Color is a dark purple, nose of black fruits, violets, cherry. Considering bottle open 4 hrs pretty good eh. Palate showed masses of fruit, but was told wine closed down after an hour of opening. Ripe blackberries, cherry, licorice and built for the long haul I`d say. Wine is around downtown but not sure of price. Over $35 I think?

WTN: `01 Sogrape Douro Reserva.

At the recent Portugal wine event I posted on, this wine really stood out at a great price ($17 Cdn). Huge set-up at this quinta and some fab wines including the Dao Duque de Viseu. Sogrape is the home of Mateus Rose!

Good natural cork, opened one hour but not decanted. 13.5% alc.

C. Medium garnet, a nice medium centre with a very light watery purple rim.

N. Dried currants, mocha, savoury spice, red berry, floral at first. Very complex and inviting.

P. Initial entry thought is big fruit here, soft tannins, excellent balance. Wine has a terrific mouthfeel, medium to full bodied and good Douro character.
Cherry and plum as it opens w. some earthyness. Not much spice or pepper here, hint of sweetness as it airs. This is holding up nicely, and will drink for another 2 years. Has great verve and grip after 6 yrs!

**after 24 hrs, still great w. exceptional mid-palate. Very little sediment noted as I drain the bottle. Try this forumites, you will enjoy!